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Classic Wings Magazine WWII Naval Aviation Research Pacific Luftwaffe Resource Center
When Hollywood Ruled The Skies - Volumes 1 through 4 by Bruce Oriss


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 10:16 pm 
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Hi Gary- I'm not trying to turnit into a D! I'm still trying to figure out which Info I have that can help get the radios operable... :shock:

If you have pics, can you send them to me/post them? I can tell what goes where, and help them from there-
Thank!
Robbie


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 10:50 pm 
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Gary, believe me, I'm not trying to turn it into a D model. The only information I have at this very moment is stuff on the D model. I have nothing on the A other than that text description that I posted from Don O. If he's talking about behind the wing, then I'm just misreading him and that's my fault. All I'm trying to do at this very moment is figure out what I have, what I need to make those parts complete, find out what I need in addition to those parts for either this year or next to finish the installation, and make it look as close to stock as original. I'm going to put these radios where they would have been when this airplane rolled off the line, not where some other airplane had them in mid-1945 or later as that's what the instructions were to do.

Once I get the photo from Don (or anyone else) and know what it needs to look like, I can go back to the manual and make a list of what I'm missing. I was only stating that the stuff I have now in hand is listed as part of what on the D model is the Liaison Radio equipment that is placed behind the co-pilot. I am reasonably sure that on the B-24A this was not the same case, and thus, pending the receipt of the needed photos, I'm not making any plans for "site specific" progress.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:37 am 
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:39 am 
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Last edited by Second Air Force on Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:48 am 
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retroaviation wrote:
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Hate to have to ask, but where, exactly are we looking at- looks like over the rear of the wing. But also see what look like insulation panels on the fuselage closer to the camera- certainly not in a production bomber? Sorry, just not fully informed of the nuances of the early(heck, even the late) B-24s interior appointments. Is that possibly a demo mock up, subject to later revision, etc?

That said, I will study the pic & see what info I can help with to get the comm details hammered out...

Robbie


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:57 am 
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At the bottom, center of the picture is the door going into the aft bomb bay. The mid-floor is folded back to gain access to that door in this picture. In flight, the top gunner would've folded those doors closed and stood on what looks to be a simple step stool, to stick his head out the hole in the top of the airplane (see picture)......

Image


The appointments inside (i.e., insulation, side panels, etc.) were indeed on the production airplanes, but taken out in the later models.

Gary


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:20 pm 
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retroaviation wrote:
At the bottom, center of the picture is the door going into the aft bomb bay. The mid-floor is folded back to gain access to that door in this picture. In flight, the top gunner would've folded those doors closed and stood on what looks to be a simple step stool, to stick his head out the hole in the top of the airplane (see picture)......

The appointments inside (i.e., insulation, side panels, etc.) were indeed on the production airplanes, but taken out in the later models.

Gary


So the radio operator's office was over the bomb bay? It is still that way in the B-24? I toured Witchcraft, seemed like the BB was up to top of fuselage, but it is a later bird- or am I just misremembering?

Thanks for the info- starting to get an idea of how it goes together. Do you have any of the sketches of the Radio Op Compartment similar to the one of the top gunner position?

Robbie


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:50 pm 
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The radio operator on a B-24A sits above the rear bomb bay. The front bomb bay is limited in height to the bottom of the wing, so I suspect that's how all B-24s are.

Y'all have fun.

Gary


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:58 pm 
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retroaviation wrote:
The radio operator on a B-24A sits above the rear bomb bay. The front bomb bay is limited in height to the bottom of the wing, so I suspect that's how all B-24s are.

Y'all have fun.

Gary


Thanks Gary! I'm trying to help in a project near to my heart, but a few thousand miles away... I do know my radios, tho!

I found the BC-375, BC-348, the TU-X tuning units in the photo, these are the liaison sets- where do the command sets go? Is that them just forward of the BC-348 receiver on the desk? I need a straight on shot... ;)

Robbie


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:02 pm 
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You're welcome, Robbie. Thanks for your help with this. I no longer have any say over what goes on with the airplane (beyond airworthiness issues), but I still find myself somewhat interested in what goes on with it myself. So y'all just keep the updates coming and I'll just try to sit back and lurk.

Gary


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:06 pm 
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CAPFlyer wrote:
To quote Don:
Quote:
I want to fabricate a radio operators table (like in the
picture) and mount it on the pilot's side of the compartment. Metal frame and wooden table top. The right-side facing bench style seat currently installed will be removed altogether. The left-side facing seat will remain on-board, but be moved to the right to accommodate the table and so two people can still ride up there. I realize this isn't 100% original of a configuration (as you'll see by the picture), but nobody will know any different, it will be a good representation of what was original, and we will still have enough seating for everybody. The radio equipment will be mounted on top of the table with hopefully some other accommodations to make the station look complete.


I think I may have been misunderstanding his explanation, but the radios he included are part of the liaison radio system that was mounted up front behind the copilot in the B-24D, but may have been aft in the B-24A.


Is there room for having it to one side? Won't that block the window?

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:38 pm 
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Django wrote:
CAPFlyer wrote:
To quote Don:
Quote:
I want to fabricate a radio operators table (like in the
picture) and mount it on the pilot's side of the compartment. Metal frame and wooden table top. The right-side facing bench style seat currently installed will be removed altogether. The left-side facing seat will remain on-board, but be moved to the right to accommodate the table and so two people can still ride up there. I realize this isn't 100% original of a configuration (as you'll see by the picture), but nobody will know any different, it will be a good representation of what was original, and we will still have enough seating for everybody. The radio equipment will be mounted on top of the table with hopefully some other accommodations to make the station look complete.


I think I may have been misunderstanding his explanation, but the radios he included are part of the liaison radio system that was mounted up front behind the copilot in the B-24D, but may have been aft in the B-24A.


Is there room for having it to one side? Won't that block the window?

ImageImage


To do it properly, to an original/authentic configuration, they'd have to reconfigure that entire section... Now they have to decide HOW they want to present it: correctly, or with compromises to accommodate other needs. (No insult intended- just mean either original or to a newer concept)

I'm just here to help with the radios! I'll stay out of the originality argument... Although I am sure most of you guys know MY views... ;)

Robbie


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 3:15 pm 
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I think the floor as it stands now is actually located too high based on the pictures, but no matter, what I've been instructed in e-mails (BTW Robbie, the picture above is what I just e-mailed you so I guess we're on the same page now) and what I'll clarify for sure tonight at the meeting is that we want a representative installation, not a 100% accurate one. The Bench Seats currently installed will stay, but be relocated to the right (when looking forward) of where they are now to give room for the table. I'm thinking that I may also need to change the height of the table so that it is at a more comfortable level with the low seats that are installed anyway, so that will help with the window issue. I will be getting measurements tonight of how much room I have to work with in the location mentioned, so hopefully I'll have a better idea of what I can and can't fit into the area.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 3:37 pm 
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Ugh, I'm trying to keep my thoughts to myself here, but I just can't.

The floor is NOT too high. It's as low as it can be and still accomodate the bomb racks. I'm not trying to sound defensive here, but I know I am, so take my comments with a grain of salt. I didn't just put that floor (or anything else in that airplane) in "willy-nilly." I tried to make it as close to original as I could, with what piddly-ass drawings and photos I had, in the extremely short amount of time to do it in. Are there some things that aren't quite right? You bet. Are there other things that aren't quite finished? Of course. But before we start saying things like "that floor looks too high, based on the pictures," let's take a look at the airplane and see why the floor really looks that way. I agree that the radio operator would've had to sit in an uncomfortable position in that seat (which is why I assume you think the floor is too high), but you must remember, the control cables didn't run across the top of the airplane way back when it was built, like they are now. I simply didn't have the time to relocate them. That may be what gives the perception of the floor not being right, I dunno.

Okaaaaaaay. Deeeeeeep breaths. Counting to ten...............

All right, sorry about that. Look, I know that nobody meant any harm with what was posted and I greatly appreciate all of the help. It's my passion for the work I do that is likely what ran volunteers like y'all off in the first place, so I apologize. But I just can't help retaining pride in the partial transformation of that airplane, and when I read comments like that, I tend to take 'em personal.

No harm, no foul.

I'm done now.

Gary


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 4:20 pm 
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CAP-
In regards to the recog. light control unit, it may be easier to just flat out get a NOS one... theyre on eBay quite frequently for around $20. It'll take you more than 2 hours to clean/rewire that one so at $10/hr your already ahead! Cannot wait to see the installation. BTW I'll be in town from the 18th of Dec to Jan 5th If you are working on the intallation sometime then give me a hollar Id love to help, I'm only on the other side of ADS you know 8)

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