Warbird Information Exchange

DISCLAIMER: The views expressed on this site are the responsibility of the poster and do not reflect the views of the management.
It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 5:51 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Classic Wings Magazine WWII Naval Aviation Research Pacific Luftwaffe Resource Center
When Hollywood Ruled The Skies - Volumes 1 through 4 by Bruce Oriss


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:34 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:48 pm
Posts: 1625
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
A lot of aircraft manufacturer names are pretty straightforward. For example, most of them are named after the founder like Boeing, Grumman, Lockheed, Martin, or Northrop. However, there are a few that have names with less obvious origins. I have been thinking about two examples and come up with theories as to where the names came from and was wondering what everyone thought.

The first is the Eastern Aircraft Division of General Motors. I believe it was likely called as such because, since 1933, General Motors already had a "Western Aircraft Division": North American Aviation. Further reinforcing this notion is the fact that North American Aviation was the successor to the General Aviation Manufacturing Corporation, which had been located on the East Coast. So General Motors already had experience with an "eastern" division.

The second is Republic Aviation Corporation. The company was obviously renamed because Alexander P. de Seversky was forced out as president. However, what is less clear is why the name "Republic" was selected. As noted by de Seversky's Wikipedia article:
Wikipedia wrote:
A controversial contract Seversky negotiated in secret with the Japanese for 20 SEV-2PA-B3 fighters created antagonism with the War Department, leading inevitably to the U.S. government putting pressure on the USAAC to limit the P-35 order to the initial batch of 76 aircraft.

Further exacerbating the issue may have been the fact that de Seversky was a Russian immigrant - a non-American - whose loyalties could have been questioned. My theory is that, in the wake of the scandal, the board decided to try to counteract the bad press by going for as patriotic a name as possible. If so, Republic would not have been the first company to go that route. As early as 1929, Continental Motors had been using a depiction of the U.S. Capitol with the slogan "Powerful as the Nation" on top as their logo.

Do these seem reasonable to anyone? Or are they way off base? Anyone have their own theories for other companies?

EDIT: I'll throw in a few more:

The name North American Aviation reflects its founding as a holding company. The generic, but broad nature suggests that it is meant to represent a varied conglomeration of aviation assets located across the United States. (Despite the suggestion, as far as I know, North American never included any companies in Canada or Mexico.) As mentioned above, one of the predecessor companies to North American was the General Aviation Manufacturing Corporation, which has an equally broad and generic name. It reflects the general trend of consolidation of the aircraft industry that was going on shortly before the 1929 stock market crash. A trend which also resulted in the Aviation Corporation and United Aircraft and Transport.[1][2][3]

The Consolidated Aircraft Corporation, founded in 1923, was named in reference to the fact that it combined the assets of the Gallaudet Aircraft Company and the design rights of the Dayton-Wright Company. It is worth noting that the creation of an unrelated company called the "Consolidated Instrument Company of America" occurred only four years later.[4] However, both of these predate the grouping of aircraft companies in 1929.

_________________
Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:39 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:18 pm
Posts: 1933
Location: Meriden,Ct.
Don't forget where I work, Pratt & Whitney.. :wink:

Phil

_________________
A man's got to know his limitations.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:08 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:27 am
Posts: 5229
Location: Eastern Washington
For unexpected aircraft company names, one of my favorites is the UK firm Beagle (British Executive & General Aviation, Ltd), a firm which tried to market UK built general aviation types in the '60s.

Some of their aircraft were the Husky, Terrier, Airedale (all based on Austers...a UK development of the basic Taylorcraft series), Pup, Bulldog (a military trainer variant of the Pup built by Scottish Aviation after Beagle's collapse), and getting away from dogs, the B.206 light twin...and its RAF counterpart...(and getting back to dogs) the Basset.

A couple of weeks ago, to my surprise there was a RAF-marked Bulldog on the ramp.
Unfortunately, it left before I could get a good look at it. Must be fairly rare in the U.S....I know I never saw one when I was in the U.K.

_________________
Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:54 am 
Offline
Been here a long time
Been here a long time

Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 1:16 am
Posts: 11276
Noha307 wrote:
A lot of aircraft manufacturer names are pretty straightforward. For example, most of them are named after the founder like Boeing, Grumman, Lockheed, Martin, or Northrop.


Lockheed is a special case in aviation perhaps, though a lot of immigrants changed their names for this reason.

Quote:
Loughead legally changed his name to Allan Lockheed, the phonetic spelling of his family name to avoid spelling confusion, in 1934.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_Lockheed


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2021 8:32 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:48 pm
Posts: 1625
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
JohnB wrote:
For unexpected aircraft company names, one of my favorites is the UK firm Beagle (British Executive & General Aviation, Ltd)

Never heard that explanation before. Interesting!

It reminds me of how I recently learned that the original name of the Gloster Aircraft Company was the Gloucestershire Aircraft Company, but apparently it was changed because no one could spell or pronounce it![1]

bdk wrote:
Lockheed is a special case in aviation perhaps, though a lot of immigrants changed their names for this reason.

Quote:
Loughead legally changed his name to Allan Lockheed, the phonetic spelling of his family name to avoid spelling confusion, in 1934.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_Lockheed

I had forgotten about that. It always reminds me of how Carl Spaatz added the second "a" in his last name for the same reason. Something I didn't realize, though, was that Robin Olds's father did so too:
Wikipedia wrote:
Spaatz was a neighbor and close associate of Lieutenant Colonel Robert Olds at Langley Field, Virginia in the 1930s. Olds had similarly changed the spelling of his name (from Oldys) in 1931 because of common mispronunciation and recommended Spaatz to the same attorney he used for his own change.[2]


What's interesting to me is that Allan Lockheed had a relatively short involvement with the company that made his name famous. He left the company in June 1929, less than three years after it was founded. Indeed, while the name of the company itself was changed earlier, as your quote notes, he didn't even change his last name until 1934. It makes me think of how many of the famous World War II aircraft were designed by individuals other than the person the company was named after.

_________________
Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:10 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:27 am
Posts: 5229
Location: Eastern Washington
I have always wondered about the Loughead/Lockheed story.

I wanted to see if the name change was done purely for the benefit of the Americans...or if the mispronuciation was an issue elsewhere.

My wife is English, as is her sister (go figure!).
Both are well educated and come from East Anglia, an area what is pretty middle of the road accent-wise. Certainly not a broad regional accent like some UK regions.

They were talking via Skype so I spelled the name and told them it was Scottish and asked them how they would pronounced it.
Both my wife and sister in law said they would have pronounced it as...
Loch (or Loff)-head.
So the pronunciation issue was far from just a American thing.

The name change was done when the second Lockheed firm was formed in 1926. The first, with the Loughead spelling, was defunct in 1920.

At some point, the change also became handy when Malcolm made his fortune in automotive hydraulic brakes which he patented in 1917.
What I haven't determined is whether the spelling change was used for the brake company before the aircraft firm. It very well could have been.
Lockheed brakes were marketed and used in many UK autos before the war and "Lockheed brakes" became a synonym for hydraulic brakes in the UK and Europe.

_________________
Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.


Last edited by JohnB on Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:19 pm 
Offline
2000+ Post Club
2000+ Post Club

Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2005 10:16 am
Posts: 2295
JohnB wrote:
I have always wondered about the Loughead/Lockheed story.

I wanted to see if the name change was done purely for the benefit of the Americans...or if the mispronuciation was an issue elsewhere.

My wife is English, as is her sister (go figure!).
Both are well educated and come from East Anglia, an area what is pretty middle of the road accent-wise. Certainly not a broad regional accent like some UK regions.

They were talking via Skype so I spelled the name and told them it was Scottish and asked them how they would pronounced it.
Both my wife and sister in law said they would have pronounced it as...
Loch (or Loff)-head.
So the pronunciation issue was far from just a American thing.

Just to throw confusion into it all....
Is the "lough" pronounced like:
Rough/Tough (Luff)
Through (Loo)
Dough/Furlough (Low)
Cough (Loff)
Slough/Plough (UK Plow) (Lau)
Hiccough (Lup)
Thorough (La)
I think there's a couple more...

_________________
Those who possess real knowledge are rare.

Those who can set that knowledge into motion in the physical world are rarer still.

The few who possess real knowledge and can set it into motion of their own hands are the rarest of all.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:28 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2020 2:36 am
Posts: 309
Location: 5nm W of Biggin Hill
Lough is the Irish spelling of the Scottish Loch or English Lake, and pronounced with a sort of soft K sound I think, so presume the name has filtered through time as "somebody who is from the Head of the Lake" or some such connotation. Some Scots pronounce "head" as "heed".


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:06 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:48 pm
Posts: 1625
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Not really an origin, but it's worth pointing out that the official name of the Beech Aircraft Corporation remained just that from its founding until at least 1987. (This is when the "Beech Aircraft Corporation" copyright line last appeared at the bottom of its advertisements in Flying magazine.[1] However, the full name would remain in the advertiser's index until 1994.[2]) Despite how it has been used, the name "Beechcraft" was technically only a brand until the company's merger with British Aerospace Corporate Jets to form Hawker Beechcraft.

_________________
Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2021 8:21 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:27 am
Posts: 5229
Location: Eastern Washington
The Hawker Beechcraft name applied only to the Jets. Not The piston and turboprops.

As Wiki notes...

"In 1994, Raytheon merged Beechcraft with the Hawker product line it had acquired in 1993 from British Aerospace, forming Raytheon Aircraft Company. In 2002, the Beechcraft brand was revived to again designate the Wichita-produced aircraft. ".

So, Beechcraft were the aircraft produced in Kansas by Raytheon...as opposed to the UK designed jets.

_________________
Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2022 5:38 pm 
Offline
1000+ Posts!
1000+ Posts!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:48 pm
Posts: 1625
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
To build on the Beech/Beechcraft issue above, there are three other similar cases which I have run into from time to time:

First, should the proper format of the Avengers not built by Grumman be "Eastern TBM Avenger" or "General Motors TBM Avenger"? (On a semi-related note, it seems to be an unofficial convention that the license builder is sometimes included in parentheses after the designer's name. As in, "Grumman (Eastern) TBM Avenger". However, this is a bit different from what is being asked here.)

Second, the manufacturer of the Kaydet biplane. Is it "Stearman" "Boeing", "Boeing-Stearman" or something else? For background, the United Aircraft and Transport Corporation, which also owned Boeing, acquired the Stearman Aircraft Corporation in 1929. Then, in 1934, as a result of antitrust legislation, UATC was forced to split up. The company was split three ways, with Boeing receiving the Stearman subsidiary. By 1938, it was being referred to as the "Stearman Aircraft division" (usually with a lowercase "D" in "division"). Finally, on 10 September 1941, it was announced that that subsidiary in Kansas was changed to "Wichita Division, Boeing Airplane [C]ompany".[1]

Hyphenated manufacturer names are traditionally only used when the two companies involved are involved in a merger of equals and not a buyout of one by the other. So, the term "Boeing-Stearman" does not seem appropriate. Its worth noting that Cessna and Beechcraft are currently in the same relationship vis-à-vis Textron, but the "brand names" are still used. So, the continual use of a subsidiary's name is not out of the question. However, after the name change in 1941, the name "Stearman" was no longer used. Then, it seems, any aircraft built after that date should be referred to as a "Boeing PT-17 Kaydet". The situation of aircraft completed before that date is less clear and, without additional evidence, could be referred to as either "Stearman" or "Boeing". (For further discussion of this topic, see a post on aircraft name change hypotheticals.)

Third, the full title of the F4U is often written "Chance Vought F4U Corsair" instead of "Vought F4U Corsair". Of the three cases, this is the one I have the most definite answer for. The correct form is the latter. To be sure, although founded as the "Lewis and Vought Corporation", all but one of the variations of the full name of the company between 1922 and 1961 included "Chance Vought":[2]

  • Chance Vought Corporation: 1922-1935
  • Chance Vought Aircraft: 1935-1939
  • Vought-Sikorsky: 1939-1943
  • Chance Vought Aircraft: 1943-1954
  • Chance Vought Aircraft, Incorporated: 1954-1960
  • Chance Vought Corporation: 1960-1961

Despite this, as far as I am aware, there are no other instances of including the first name of the company founder when writing the full title an aircraft and it seems Vought should be no different.

I have been unsure on how to handle these for a long time, so I am interested in what everyone else's thoughts are. Do you more frequently see one of these formats than the other? If you wrote articles about any of these aircraft, which did you use?

_________________
Tri-State Warbird Museum Collections Manager & Museum Attendant

Warbird Philosophy Webmaster


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], wwmb43 and 72 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group