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 Post subject: Bill Lear Mustang Crash
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 8:22 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Sydney Australia
Randy,

I think that I have shown that a data plate and clear provenance are NOT needed to identify an aircraft. Ownership and provenance does not guarantee anything and the FAA appear not to be even bothered to check their own records when it comes to the registration of an aircraft.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 11:50 pm 
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Mustang51 wrote:
I think that I have shown that a data plate and clear provenance are NOT needed to identify an aircraft. Ownership and provenance does not guarantee anything and the FAA appear not to be even bothered to check their own records when it comes to the registration of an aircraft.


In your case, that's correct...but even your case isn't closed yet, so it's too early to start making broad-brush statements about the process based solely on it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:32 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:15 pm
Posts: 99
Location: Montmagny,France
Just found a message on my external HDD from the old forum, some 5 years ago:

Posted by Stephen Grey on 7:37:24 2/14/2002 from 195.202.244.28:

My attention has been brought to the postings on the interesting controversy surrounding P51D ex SwedishAF serial 26158. I may be able to shed some light on the a/c.

Many years ago, I helped some Swedish friends - who were looking for an ex Swedish AF P51. I traced a potential candidate to Col. Israel Itzahki &, after close inspection in Israel, concluded from a Swedish AF data plate located in the tail cone, that it was J26158. Checks with the Swedish AF confirmed that identity to be registered as US serial 44-63864 in their contemporary records . Col. Itzahki was a fine upstanding Officer in the Israeli AF & was certainly unaware of the significance of that Swedish stainless plate & totally unconcerned as to its US serial data - being very bemused by my meticulous researches. I established that the a/c had much earlier been registered with the Israeli Civil Aviation Authority & inspected by them on the basis of its Military records & physical evidence. Having taken it around the patch & struck a deal on behalf of my friends, I asked for an Export Certificate of Airworthiness & an Export Licence. All of these Documents with the relevant identity marks were produced after due examination by the relevant Government Bodies.

The Israeli AF had delisted that Aircraft and sold it to a scrap dealer. It is important to note that the Swedish Aircraft were not clandestinely purchased by the Israeli Government & were not stripped of Identifying Marks (as were many of their combat aircraft, often acquired in a covert manner via Agents & dealers. Itzahki purchased this a/c (largely complete & undamaged) and set to work on its restoration to flight with very meagre resources. Certainly, there were potentially airworthy parts donated to the a/c from various delericts, possibly including #41 (later recovered by the esteemed Robs Lamplough & subsequently stripped of the best parts for his chosen restoration, prior to being
sold on).

After I received permission to fly the a/c out of the country, it was ferried to Sweden (an eventful story all of its own) and submitted to a strip & IRAN. During the process its original Swedish AF paint scheme was found, under the Israeli AF markings, those being beneath very rudamentary civilian markings.

Whilst I have no doubt as to the authenticity of this a/c's identity, I cannot speak for the Bill Lear a/c (which was on an FAA ferry permit, had never been inspected by the FAA & never was civilian registered in Israel, having been purchased from a disposals organisation . Unfortunately the aircraft was totally wrecked in a fatal accident in Iceland on its ferry flight and the mystery of how it came to be US registered with the same number has died with Bill Lear & the unfortunate pilot - I understand the few smashed parts recovered cannot support claim to be an a/c, let alone help furnish an identity. My guess is the number was transposed or selected "out of a hat", being one of those 25 which were a matter of record as being officially imported, as opposed to those without US traceable identity.

I hope these ramblings provide some inight.

I recently checked that there had been no potential transposition of nos. with the Swedish AF Museum, whose outstanding Director was adamant as to the liason between 26158 & 44-63864.

I have been priviledged to have known & flown this a/c over the years - it is ratty but pure North American and nobody involved in its recovery, restoration & subsequent civilian history can have had the slightest interest in 'counterfeiting' during the formative periods of its civilian registration


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