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 Post subject: Unboxing Kermit's Bf109G
PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2019 3:47 am 
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Kermit weeks' latest video, a big box full of goodies



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2019 3:41 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 8:25 am 
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The first thing I thought when I saw the size of the box was, did they scoop the remains of a crashed 109 and shovel it into the crate. Looks like the box had everything but the major assemblies. Based on the Nov 2018 update, neither of the engines Kermit has have been rebuilt. Need a march 2019 update.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:39 pm 
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maradamx3 wrote:
The first thing I thought when I saw the size of the box was, did they scoop the remains of a crashed 109 and shovel it into the crate. Looks like the box had everything but the major assemblies. Based on the Nov 2018 update, neither of the engines Kermit has have been rebuilt. Need a march 2019 update.


No point in rebuilding the engines for something he'll just park in a hangar..

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 1:11 am 
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ZRX61 wrote:
maradamx3 wrote:
The first thing I thought when I saw the size of the box was, did they scoop the remains of a crashed 109 and shovel it into the crate. Looks like the box had everything but the major assemblies. Based on the Nov 2018 update, neither of the engines Kermit has have been rebuilt. Need a march 2019 update.


No point in rebuilding the engines for something he'll just park in a hangar..


History indicates that flying 109's don't last very long before getting pranged, so I wouldn't fault Kermit for not flying that one.

But your point is well taken. Kermit has preserved a lot of aircraft and parked <seemingly> the majority of 'em.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:13 am 
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Kyleb wrote:
ZRX61 wrote:
maradamx3 wrote:
The first thing I thought when I saw the size of the box was, did they scoop the remains of a crashed 109 and shovel it into the crate. Looks like the box had everything but the major assemblies. Based on the Nov 2018 update, neither of the engines Kermit has have been rebuilt. Need a march 2019 update.


No point in rebuilding the engines for something he'll just park in a hangar..


History indicates that flying 109's don't last very long before getting pranged, so I wouldn't fault Kermit for not flying that one.

But your point is well taken. Kermit has preserved a lot of aircraft and parked <seemingly> the majority of 'em.


Something else to throw into the equation. Kermit's airfield has a grass strip. 109's are much more forgiving to operate off of grass than pavement. I've read of a few operators who will only operate their 109's off of grass. Between that and the 100-200 hour overhaul time of the DB engines, it doesn't make much sense to take them away from the home strip.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 8:23 am 
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Considering that he's spending his time on most of these restorations to control his money outflow and his guys' workload, overhauling the engine is the last thing you do. I've never really liked people who overhaul and pickle an engine 5 years or more before they plan to fly. It means that there's a lot of things that will need an in-depth check and possibly even a second overhaul before it gets hung on the airplane. Why not wait and get the engine when you're actually ready for it - when everything else is done? I think he has the right idea waiting, as he has with other projects, until the project is nearly done and then getting the engine done.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:57 pm 
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CAPFlyer wrote:
Considering that he's spending his time on most of these restorations to control his money outflow and his guys' workload, overhauling the engine is the last thing you do. I've never really liked people who overhaul and pickle an engine 5 years or more before they plan to fly. It means that there's a lot of things that will need an in-depth check and possibly even a second overhaul before it gets hung on the airplane. Why not wait and get the engine when you're actually ready for it - when everything else is done? I think he has the right idea waiting, as he has with other projects, until the project is nearly done and then getting the engine done.

Depends on shop lead times I suppose.Having the almost finished plane sitting around for a couple of years while waiting for an engine isnt desirable.Best is have it ready when its needed so the project workflow goes smoothly.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:14 pm 
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I don't disagree that you don't want a finished plane (or nearly finished) waiting several years for an engine, but his Bf-109 project isn't there yet. The fuselage isn't even done yet, much less the wings and tail (which they discussed having Meier Motors do the tail), so even if he started the engine project now, it would probably still be done before the plane. Since there are several groups (including Meier) who do the engine, getting an engine won't be a major issue and it'll take well under 2 years (most likely less than 9 months even). It's not like he's having an engine custom built. Vintage V12s can easily rebuild an engine in under 6 months without rushing, so there's no reason to believe it would take more than a year to do a DB601.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:24 am 
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CAPFlyer wrote:
I don't disagree that you don't want a finished plane (or nearly finished) waiting several years for an engine, but his Bf-109 project isn't there yet. The fuselage isn't even done yet, much less the wings and tail (which they discussed having Meier Motors do the tail), so even if he started the engine project now, it would probably still be done before the plane. Since there are several groups (including Meier) who do the engine, getting an engine won't be a major issue and it'll take well under 2 years (most likely less than 9 months even). It's not like he's having an engine custom built. Vintage V12s can easily rebuild an engine in under 6 months without rushing, so there's no reason to believe it would take more than a year to do a DB601.

I didn't know that Meier Motors overhauls German engines. Every picture of the DB engines that I've seen on their facebook page shows them coming from outside contractors after rebuild. Even the DB601 for the Condor Legion 109 which is now zero-timed and ready for flight was done at Nixon's place. When did they start in the DB overhaul business?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:18 am 
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OD/NG wrote:
I didn't know that Meier Motors overhauls German engines. Every picture of the DB engines that I've seen on their facebook page shows them coming from outside contractors after rebuild. Even the DB601 for the Condor Legion 109 which is now zero-timed and ready for flight was done at Nixon's place. When did they start in the DB overhaul business?


Not sure that Meier is doing overhauls, but they have an in-house engine expert with Felix Ohlhoff. And staff from Vintage V12s have traveled there. I think Mike was over there a few years back to troubleshoot an engine issue.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:48 am 
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Yeah, the DB engines that have been used in 109 projects at Meier have been done (predominantly) by Mike Nixon's company, as well as Mike Rinner's company in Austria. They do some serious engine work at Meier, but I haven't heard of them getting into DB engine restorations/overhauls. Of course for Kermit's project, there is a DB 605 destined for it (certainly to come out of Nixon's shop, for which he already has a long relationship with).


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:08 am 
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CAPFlyer wrote:
... I've never really liked people who overhaul and pickle an engine 5 years or more before they plan to fly. It means that there's a lot of things that will need an in-depth check and possibly even a second overhaul before it gets hung on the airplane. ...


In most cases the engine is the single largest expense, so many homebuilders or restorers (and lets be honest, there is a lot in common) will do that first while the enthusiasm and budget is fresh. It's also a hedge against the project going pear-shaped. You can recoup (or try at least) part of the investment.

Of course that only works if you properly preserve it, which sadly, many don't.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:45 am 
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It's been a long time since I've seen a restoration sitting on it's gear finished and waiting on an engine or some needed part for that engine. Maybe if it were a Japanese design. There seem to be sources and better resources and cooperation and finding these needed items.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:36 am 
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shrike wrote:
CAPFlyer wrote:
... I've never really liked people who overhaul and pickle an engine 5 years or more before they plan to fly. It means that there's a lot of things that will need an in-depth check and possibly even a second overhaul before it gets hung on the airplane. ...


In most cases the engine is the single largest expense, so many homebuilders or restorers (and lets be honest, there is a lot in common) will do that first while the enthusiasm and budget is fresh. It's also a hedge against the project going pear-shaped. You can recoup (or try at least) part of the investment.

Of course that only works if you properly preserve it, which sadly, many don't.


I can understand that desire, however you can always "buy" the overhaul/engine/whatever and then schedule it for "delivery" later on. That's what Kermit did for a couple of his projects and he talked about it in his Vintage V12 video because he has several engines there which he bought and the crew is just waiting on Kermit to say "go" to do the overhaul. I think in at least one case, Kermit has paid for the basic work already as well (which helps Vintage V12s by giving them some liquidity for other projects).


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