Warbird Information Exchange

Hi All,

I have a question I'm hoping you folks might be able to help me with. Most often we see photos of TBF/TBM Avengers with the rear gunner's turret at the aft end of the canopy. But I recently read that there were also patrol versions, without the turret.

See:
http://www.hyperscale.com/galleries/avengeras3jb_1.htm

Do you know if these were only foreign versions, or did the US fly patrol versions without the turret during the war, as well? If so, can anyone post photos of the US version...or direct me to a link with more information and photos?

Thanks either way for your help!

--Tom

The model depicts a Canadian AS.3 coverted by Fairey aircraft in Canada from turrreted TBM-3s post war. They were Canadian only conversions. See:

http://www.rcaf.com/aircraft/photos/avenger_1.jpg

The TBM-3S was a similar U.S. conversion for ASW patrol post war. To the best of my knowledge all wartime combat TBM/TBFs carried the turret in U.S. service. I may have a photo or two at home of the post war TBM-3S canopy that was similar to the Canadian mod. Some TBM-3S were operated by the FAA as the Avenger AS.4, Japan, and the Dutch.

Finally there was the TBM-3R transport/COD conversion. An example of the 3R conversion is BuNo. 53319.

http://www.warbirdregistry.org/avengerregistry/avenger-53319.html

Hope this helps,

Jim

Those look like those firebomber ones in Canada. They had some for sale a while back that had the same type of canopy. So I guess some are still around. Cool and unique!

Didn't the Marines use one with a similar canopy arrangement to evacuate wounded on strechers , in Korea?

During WWII, some thinking was directed towards extending the range of the Avenger to serve in a scouting role. The plans included reducing the crew from three to two, as well as mounting a lighter-weight turret. The plans ultimately fell through.

I have no official documentation, but by comparing existing pics I'm convinced that Emerson's experimental turret design for the Avenger was modified slightly to become the production turret for the TBY.

_________________
It was a good idea, it just didn't work.

Yes, many wounded Marines were evaced from the Puson Perimeter
by TBM CODs and they were active in fact the whole war.

_________________
Don't touch my junk!!

Great info Jim (AirJimL2), thank you for giving me some details on the history of the design. Also appreciate all the other inputs posted so far...thanks guys!

What got me going on this was not only the modeling link I posted, but at a visit to the Olympic Air Museum in Olympia, WA., I saw this TBM...

http://www.olympicflightmuseum.com/airc ... ry/tbm.htm

...and noticed the unusual back canopy. I wasn't sure if that was just an expedient way to close off the canopy's aft end until a turret could be found and restored, or what. While researching this, I found all kinds of photos of Canadian fire bombers with similar types of aft canopies, as well as other shapes as well. So I'm trying to get an understanding of what was "production" and what were the post-production mods. There appears to be a lot of variety out there. For example, check-out the photos at this link:

http://scalefirebombers.com/index3.html

(on the left menu, select "Fixed-Wing Tankers, Part 2", then again on the left menu at the very bottom, select "TBM/TBF" and scroll through all the great firebird photos)

By the way...that "ScaleFirebombers" site has tons of great post-war warbird photos to look though...kept me busy for hours and hours!

Brian's OFM FBM COD has been for sale for a number of years.
We traded 2600 harness's with them a few years back when our 2600
was built up has the wrong dash number.

_________________
Don't touch my junk!!

By the way, speaking of TBMs without rear turrets. Steve Hay used to have one in Atlantic colors. He sold it a few years back, and rumor has it it ended up out west. Does anyone have any ideas on where it is now?

Courtesy has a COD version for sale,

http://www.courtesyaircraft.com/N325GT% ... 20Spec.htm

_________________
DEEP THOUGHTS BY KIDS:
"If we could just get everyone to close their eyes and visualize world peace for an hour, imagine how serene and quiet it would be until the looting started. Age 15 "


Deep Thoughts,
Jack Handy

RE: Courtesy has a COD version for sale,

http://www.courtesyaircraft.com/N325GT% ... 20Spec.htm

Yes...that's the same one that's out at the Olympic Flight Museum in WA.


Karpis: that TBM in Atlantic Colors...I saw a photo of that somewhere too. So would that have been an accurate paint scheme for this type of Avenger...a patrol version, after the war?

--Tom