Warbird Information Exchange

Those of you that fly formation, where did you get your training? How long did it take? How do you stay current?

FAST is the primary place that warbird guys go to learn and practice formation. A FAST card is basically the standard qualification to fly formation at any airshow.

http://www.flyfast.org/

I learned here and keep current here. There are, however, a large number of collateral requirements when you learn through this agency.

http://www.af.mil/

Dodging ripple-fired Rolands is but one of the required exercises ...



Wade

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Yeah like a cool jet to fly, uniforms, free chow, a place to stay,etc...

Lynn

The picture of all the Yaks and Nanchangs in close formation on www.flyfast.org got me thinking about something.

When there are so many planes in very close formation like that, and like the Snowbirds, or Blue Angels, etc, is there a SNAFU maneuvre, and what I mean by that is if everything goes wrong and the formation has to be ended immediately, is there a quick break that each airplane is pre-assigned to do?

Please fill me in, I've always been curious.

Cheers,

David

lets see if I can explain this, every plane has it's own bubble of space around it, they are not all flying on the same level.

The wingmen fly by visual referance on the lead plane, for most groups it is putting the tail wheel on the far wingtip, that gives you a 45 degree line, as well as a step down. In the event that lead loses his engine, and slows down, the wingman will pass under him. It works, I had a lead I was flying with run a tank dry, and our wingmen went under us like we had slammed on the brakes.

At Oshkosh, when you saw 60+ T-6s in formation, no one was directly behind someone else, they were all stepped down from the lead plane. The formations were probably a mile or more long from lead to tail and covered several hundred feet in altitude.

When I bought my plane in 1983, Earl Ketchen, an experienced military and warbird pilot was my instructor. We flew formation with other fighters/bombers on the way to the BKD airshow, Then I flew more with these guys when I was solo, Howard Pardue, and other CAF guys. I learned basically by doing, there wasn't a video then. I got my formation rating from Archie Donahue, ex CAF Corsair combat vet in about 2 seasons. I also flew with Bud Granley at Oskosh in formation. Then along came practice sessions at Kenosha, both for the fighters and later with the T-34 group where I got more practice, and more ground school/ book learning as well as the video. Along came the new program called FAST and they issued a card also so I got these from T-34 and fighter group in the early 90's.
There don't seem to be as many practice sessions for fighters nowdays, and I don't own a 34. I stay current by practicing at airshows and photo flights. For me, it is kind of like skiing, you don't forget the basics once you learn, but I
become less proficient after the winter, especially in the more dynamic or complex parts rather than just holding position straight and level.
The formation practice weekends at Kenosha were great fun, especially the top guys back then who brought a lot of humor into it, not such a grim endeavor as some make it now.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

David The following is out of the RPA Formation Manual. There are additional procedures, for "Knock it Off" (KIO) calls, "Blind" Calls, and extensive procedures for "Lost Wingman" calls, but this gives you an idea. Much depends on if the formation is straight and level, in a turn, in a climb, arrival, departure, etc.

1.10.4 Formation Break Out Procedures
The purpose of a break out is to ensure immediate separation
and to avoid a mid-air collision.
Lead
If a wingman has broken out of the flight, you may continue
the current maneuver with the current power setting to aid
in aircraft separation. If the wingman is in sight, you will be
directive and maneuver to obtain separation based on the
wing pilot’s altitude call or visual contact.

Wingman
As the wing pilot, you must break out of the formation if
you:
-Lose sight of your lead aircraft
-If you are unable to rejoin or stay in
formation without crossing directly under
or in front of Lead
-If you feel your presence in the formation
constitutes a hazard.
-When you are directed to do so by Lead

If you have lost sight, clear, then break in the safest direction
away from the last know position or flight path of Lead and
other aircraft. One technique: “look for blue sky and pull” is
appropriate for many situations (see caution below). Call
the breakout and your altitude:

“Raven 2, breaking out, climbing to 4500 feet.”

After gaining safe separation, you should confirm that Lead
is, or is not, in sight and transmit “visual”, or “blind” IAW
with this chapter. If you have reacquired Lead, remain in the
same general area but make no attempt to close on the fl ight
until Lead directs you to rejoin.

WARNING
The wing pilot may encounter a hazardous situation
in which an aggressive break out is inappropriate.
For example, if the aircraft drifts into a
position dangerously close to Lead, an aggressive
breakout may possibly result in collision. In this
situation, the wing pilot should move away from
Lead, using smooth and positive control inputs.

5.8 Breakout
Leaving formation is the same in three- and four-ship formations
as in two-ship formations, However, if number 3
leaves the formation, number 4 will follow number 3 at a
safe distance to maintain element integrity if safe to do so.
In all cases, the Flight Lead will provide adequate altitude
separation and direct the rejoin as required. An aircraft that
has left formation will not rejoin until cleared to do so.

Seems like USAF pilot training summed up the wingman breakout responsibilities (as with everything else) with an acronym:

S- If you lose Sight
H- If you are creating a Hazard
I - If you fly in front of lead
T - If Told to exit the formation

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"Take care of the little things and the big things will take care of themselves."

"Bill Greenwood"]When I bought my plane in 1983, Earl Ketchen,..."

I was on the ramp at Reno one night after ops had stopped. Earl was out in Habu flying (tuna ride???) anyway I look over to the west and here he comes prop stopped...he ran out of fuel and landed on the ramp! luckily we had just fueled up and the gas truck had left...
.. ah the good ole days!

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EVERYTHING that CAN fly should be ALLOWED to FLY!
IWO JIMA'S best narative..."GOD ISN'T HERE"
http://www.amazon.com/God-Isnt-Here-Ame ... 0976154706


P: Noise coming from under instrument panel. Sounds like a midget pounding on something with a hammer.

S: Took hammer away from midget.

Varies from team to team, but with the Thunderbirds during the T38 days (Parrish/Patterakis/Lowery) it was a "go exploded" call that anyone could initiate. Formation egress was to a prebriefed break direction.

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Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship

I thought that Roland was a headless Thompson gunner?

Rich

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Rich Kolasa
www.crystalgraphix.com