A Question About "Bent" Warbirds

[Matt_in_NC]

Obviously most of us know that when a vintage aircraft is involved in a minor (sometimes even major) accident, given time, the damage is usually fixed. My question is what happens to airframes that were involved in fatal accidents, but there is still substantial remains of the aircraft? I was looking at the P-51 crash from Camarillo thread, and it looks like there were substantial remains of that Mustang. That also made me think about the P-51A in which Gerry Beck lost his life and the Sea Fury that Charley Hillard was killed in. I mean no disrespect to any of these men or any others, but what happens to aircraft like these? Thanks

Matt

[Jack Cook]

I personally think that a a/c a pilot was killed in is carrying bad juju
Anything can being rebuilt though. All you need has a starting point is the paperwork like Jack Rousch's new P-51B for example.

[Tulio]

Does your theory about the "bad juju" carries over to another aircraft, if parts of the crashed airplane are used on another project?


Saludos,


Tulio

[bdk]

http://www.warbirdregistry.org/furyregi ... 254sf.html

They are just metal.

[CAPFlyer]

As was alluded to in the previous post, Charlie's Sea Fury is now owned by Joe T. up in Denver. After the accident, the aircraft was bought and taken to be rebuilt by the new owner. However, after the rebuild was complete the owner chose not to take the aircraft back and it sat outside the shop for a while before Joe found it. Joe told me who's shop it was, but I can't remember now (it's the same shop that rewired "Crusader" for him several years ago). Basically, as Joe put it, he got tired of sitting around without anything "fun" to fly and it was just sitting there, so he bought it. The next year he took it to Reno as a stock Sea Fury and took the Silver Unlimited Trophy.

As for Garry's P-51A, I thought that his guys said they were going to rebuild it, but I'm sure someone from up that way wouldk know for sure.

Several warbirds out there have been rebuilt 2 or 3 times after accidents both minor and major. These are complex airplanes and they crashed a lot in service. Difference was that during the War, they were putting out brand new airframes daily (sometimes hourly), so it was just faster to replace the wrecked airframe than try to repair it. I think bombers (like Ol '927) are an exception to this because their size made them useful in other roles like cargo and squadron hack so they would rebuild them as a basic airplane with no armament and modify it whereas a fighter was really only good as a fighter so there wasn't much "utility" in rebuilding them.

[Randy Haskin]

My question is what happens to airframes that were involved in fatal accidents, but there is still substantial remains of the aircraft?

I don't see how having the pilot killed in the aircraft puts any more "bad juju" on the airframe than the pilot in the airplane killing other people.

These are combat machines, after all.

[Jack Cook]

Just a feeling. I suppose I should have added go rebuild and fly it anyhow
BUT IF THE KILL DOZER SHOWS UP AT MY HOUSE I TAKE IT ALL BACK!!

[Gary Norville]

After the accident in Lakeland the Hillard Fury was brought to American Aero and repaired for the Hillard estate who still owned the aircraft, after the repairs and new paint Nelson Ezell came and test flew it and returned to Texas with it. After the return to Texas the estate sold the fury to Joe.

The plane never sat after the repairs and transfered directly from the estate to the current owner.

[308WK Crew Member]

I personally think that a a/c a pilot was killed in is carrying bad juju
Anything can being rebuilt though. All you need has a starting point is the paperwork like Jack Rousch's new P-51B for example.

What about all the recovered wrecks from years ago? Does the bad juju disappear after 50 years? Or is that theres no bad juju if the plane crashed in wartime?

[Bill Greenwood]

That Fury was not badly damaged in the accident despite it being fatal to Charlie Hilliard. It slowly rolled over and sank in the sandy soil after landing, a sad day.

[n5151ts]

..to try to kill you. its nothing personal thats just how they are. rebuild and FLY anything that will fly and PAY ATTENTION!

[The Inspector]

I know that rotables taken from Eastern 401 and placed in service had very high failure rates and reliability issues to the point that the recovered items were RFS and destroyed,

Many moons ago I crewed on a raceboat with a guy who had been an Army helicopter crewman in Lybia, one of the other crews recovered an arm rest or other smallish item (s) from Lady be Good and had serious issues with the helo until the items were removed-

I believe that the Gris-Gris (thats cajun for bad fortune and pronounced gree gree)follows the parts

[Matt_in_NC]

Thanks for the many replies. I guess if I had checked the registry I would have seen that the Hillard Sea Fury was flying again. I think that most of those killed in warbirds would want their airplanes to continue flying if possible. I was just curious what had happened to the aircraft in the previously mentioned cases. I hope they do rebuild Mr. Beck's P-51A. I can't think of a better tribute.

[CAPFlyer]

After the accident in Lakeland the Hillard Fury was brought to American Aero and repaired for the Hillard estate who still owned the aircraft, after the repairs and new paint Nelson Ezell came and test flew it and returned to Texas with it. After the return to Texas the estate sold the fury to Joe.

The plane never sat after the repairs and transfered directly from the estate to the current owner.

Gary,

I guess "sat for a while" is a relative term. Joe never really gave me much more of an idea of timeline other than that it'd been in Breckenridge for a period of time before he took Crusader there for the rewiring, saw the plane and at some point while Crusader was down decided that he should buy it for whatever reason (like I said, he told me he was missing flying a warbird, but I get the feeling there was more to the purchase than that). Did Charlie have any family who are a pilot? Because the way he talked it sounded like the plan wasn't to sell the plane originally, but that changed at some point giving him the opening to purchase the plane.

Also, thanks for reminding me that it was Breckenridge and Ezell that redid Crusader. At the time I was in Colorado, I knew about Ezell (and him being in Texas), but didn't realize that when he said Breckenridge he meant the one in Texas. At the time I remember wondering to myself why anyone would put a warbird restoration shop in Breckenridge, CO.

[Dan K]

Just a feeling. I suppose I should have added go rebuild and fly it anyhow
BUT IF THE KILL DOZER SHOWS UP AT MY HOUSE I TAKE IT ALL BACK!!

Say Jack...