Stearman question for experts

[mlenoch]

Stearman question: Does the flight manual / pilot's operating handbook specify which seat (front or back) must be occupied for solo flight? Does it specify which seat is 'pilot in command' (again, front or back)? I believe I had seen a photo of Air Corps students in solo flight occupying the front seat. I am curious if there is a Stearman limitation. [I've never flown a stock Stearman, only a 450 & 600hp version.]
Thx in advance,
VL

[STEARMAN]

Vlado,

The handbook states that solo flight is from the rear seat only. The mags and fuel switch are in the rear cockpit, but everything else is duplicated up front. Nothing is mentioned about the PIC being in the back only.

Let me known if you wnat to fly my stock Stearman at Dacy anytime. When your son's ready you should get him some time too. After going from Stearman to T6, I can see why it was so successful for the military (I skipped the BT)

Greg

[gilt]

Greg-

Not certain which manual you are referring to, the TCDS clearly states solo from either seat with one CG range and solo from rear seat only with a different range, however a Stearman with an electrical system must be soloed from the cockpit with the electrical switches/panel.

VL-

I have been told by WWII USN pilots that they soloed from the front seat with ballast in the rear seat for formation practice, it is possible the USAAF did this also but I've never heard of anything except rear seat solo in the USAAF.

Tom-

[BHawthorne]

I found these links to manuals. Hope they help:

http://www.tailwheel.nl/downloads/stearmansmall.pdf
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/attach ... earman.pdf

[yakdriver]

I think some of the Navy N2S's were set up for front seat solo. Our early N3N-3 had all of the primary switches, fuel gauge, primer. and mixture lock in the front pit. Handbook stated 125lbs ballast in the rear pit for solo flight. My uncle bought it from Jack Tillman and when I went to pick it up he insisted I fly it from the front. After getting it home I removed the mixture lock and flew it from the back. Solo pilot in the front just looks goofy in a big bipe. Don

[yakdriver]

In looking through the handbook above it shows the N2S-1 has no mixture control lock while all the others have a mix lock in the back pit. Don

[bdk]

In civilian hands at least, I've seen them both ways. Most are from the back though. In either case there should be a placard stating which is correct for that airplane.

A stock, wartime Stearman had all the important controls in both seats and I've seen wartime pictures with them being soloed from either seat. Today of course it would depend on which seat has the electrics, radio, etc. Myself, I find them easier to fly from the back (because you can see so much more.)

[gunnyperdue]

Vlado-

Greg and GiLT are correct.... the Dash-1 says you solo from the back, the TCDS the same.... the airplane in stock configuration is out of W&B with a solo in the front (during the war the Instructor sat in the front).

There is no specification of the 'PIC' seat... there have been folks who put ballast at the tail to allow solo from the front seat... this requires a 337 Field Approval. You can actually see better from the front... flying from the back of a Stearman is like flying from the back of a T-6... you can't see forward at all.... but you can see drift much better. Personal choice... my Dad liked flying from the front best... I like flying it from the back best...

Just pay attention to W&B... either way the airplane is a hoot to fly and one of my all time favorites--- even if it is a bit underpowered in the stock version... if it warms up today I'll drag mine out for a few minutes<g>. Hope this helps.

gunny

[gilt]

Gunny-

When the -1 and CAA/FAA data, TCDS or Operations limitations, conflict the CAA/FAA data takes precedence.

From the TCDS

(-1.5) to (+0.5) solo from either seat
(-4.4) to (+0.5) placard in front cockpit: "Solo from rear seat only."
When empty weight C.G. falls within this range, computation of critical fore
and aft C.G. positions is unnecessary. Ranges are not valid for non-standard arrangement or for crop duster or sprayer installations.

However if the aircraft has an electrical system it can only be soloed from the seat with accces to the electrical switches/panel, and that would have to comply with the CG limitation.

Tom-

Vlado-

Greg and GiLT are correct.... the Dash-1 says you solo from the back, the TCDS the same.... the airplane in stock configuration is out of W&B with a solo in the front (during the war the Instructor sat in the front).

There is no specification of the 'PIC' seat... there have been folks who put ballast at the tail to allow solo from the front seat... this requires a 337 Field Approval. You can actually see better from the front... flying from the back of a Stearman is like flying from the back of a T-6... you can't see forward at all.... but you can see drift much better. Personal choice... my Dad liked flying from the front best... I like flying it from the back best...

Just pay attention to W&B... either way the airplane is a hoot to fly and one of my all time favorites--- even if it is a bit underpowered in the stock version... if it warms up today I'll drag mine out for a few minutes<g>. Hope this helps.

gunny

Last edited by gilt on Sat Nov 22, 2008 9:27 am, edited 4 times in total.

[gilt]

FYI-

Off all the pre-Aerobatic Category aircraft the only two that have had this statement added to the TCDS, and therefore the only two that can legally perform aerobatics are the Stearman and Great Lakes. Just because the -1 for the L-16 lists aerobatics doesn't make them approved for a civil operated L-16............................

From the TCDS

NOTE 7. The certification basis for these airplanes does not contain operating categories, i.e., normal, utility or
acrobatic, as listed in the current certification regulations. However, since certain of these models were
designed to perform and have demonstrated the capability to perform the acrobatic maneuvers not
exceeding the load factors listed below, the words "acrobatic category" are included so that those
persons concerned with these airplanes understand their capacity in terms of current practices.
Maneuvering load factors are as follows:
A75L3, 75, A75, B75, E75, A75N1,
B75N1, D75N1 and A75J1 +6.67 to -2.67
For the above reasons, the airworthiness certificate for A75L3, 75, A75, B75, E75, A75N1, B75N1,
D75N1 and A75J1 airplanes is to be issued in the acrobatic category.

Note that the STearman is a +6.67/-2.67 aircraft, for comparison the Decathlon is a +6/-5 aircraft.

Tom-

[gunnyperdue]

GiLT-

"Gunny-

When the -1 and CAA/FAA data, TCDS or Operations limitations, conflict the CAA/FAA data takes precedence.

From the TCDS

(-1.5) to (+0.5) solo from either seat
(-4.4) to (+0.5) placard in front cockpit: "Solo from rear seat only."
When empty weight C.G. falls within this range, computation of critical fore
and aft C.G. positions is unnecessary. Ranges are not valid for non-standard arrangement or for crop duster or sprayer installations. "

As I said the airplane in STOCK configuration cannot be soloed from the front without ballast... your point sounds like you are trying to correct/ or argue with me and I am confused by your reply.

I've had Stearman's in my family for well over 30 years... my Dad's first one he put ballast at the tail so he could fly it solo from the front... I restored the second one to STOCK configuration (with some small exceptions) and I assure you that it must be soloed from the rear seat. The W&B works out that way... some folks put the battery in the baggage compartment, or an oil tank or cooler back there... this is not a stock configuration. Please make note of the operative word in this discussion.

gunny

[gilt]

Gunny-

Reference the orginal question the Stearman can clearly be soloed from either seat IF it falls within a specified CG limit.

Valdo asked if there was a specified pilot in command position and reference the TCDS there isn't one. Not challenging you, only correcting your misquote of my orginal post and simply making clear that the solo seat is dependent on CG and electrical switch/panel placement as earlier stated.

Tom-

[wacoykc]

My 1946 Stinson 108 that I restored had the original placard on the panel that gave entry speeds for loops, rolls, spins but only when operated under I believe NORMAL Category. In 1947, when they made the 108-1 and 2, Stinson removed this placard as they didn't want people to think a "family" airplane was made for aerobatics!

[gunnyperdue]

Gunny-

Reference the orginal question the Stearman can clearly be soloed from either seat IF it falls within a specified CG limit.

Valdo asked if there was a specified pilot in command position and reference the TCDS there isn't one. Not challenging you, only correcting your misquote of my orginal post and simply making clear that the solo seat is dependent on CG and electrical switch/panel placement as earlier stated.

Tom-

Tom-

As I mentioned before the operative word I used was STOCK... a stock airplane does not allow solo from the front, regardless what the TCDS says. I did not misquote you, in fact I didn't quote you at all... I referred to your post.

If you're going to be a stickler.... be correct.

gunny