Childish hypothetical question for entertainment only

[flypa38]

So this is something I've always wondered since I was a little kid. Keep in mind this is only for entertaining daydreaming! Hope it isn't too off topic and don't want to cause any trouble but here goes!

Imagine terrible localized weather is causing the threat of certain disaster at all of the major museums in the US. There is 24 hrs notice that the weather will strike and the only way to save the artifact aircraft is to fly them out. Basically enough time to service fuel, oil, hydraulics, batteries, etc.

How many and which aircraft could realistically be flown to safety? I'm talking Air Force Museum, Pensacola, Smithsonian collection and the like.......Real national treasures.

Like I said simply for childish daydreaming purposes, but could you imagine watching all those incredible aircraft take to the skies?

Again don't mean to cause trouble and hope this isn't to OT!

Looking forward to your answers!

Johnny

[sandiego89]

So this is something I've always wondered since I was a little kid. Keep in mind this is only for entertaining daydreaming! Hope it isn't too off topic and don't want to cause any trouble but here goes!

Imagine terrible localized weather is causing the threat of certain disaster at all of the major museums in the US. There is 24 hrs notice that the weather will strike and the only way to save the artifact aircraft is to fly them out. Basically enough time to service fuel, oil, hydraulics, batteries, etc.

How many and which aircraft could realistically be flown to safety? I'm talking Air Force Museum, Pensacola, Smithsonian collection and the like.......Real national treasures.

Like I said simply for childish daydreaming purposes, but could you imagine watching all those incredible aircraft take to the skies?

Again don't mean to cause trouble and hope this isn't to OT!

Looking forward to your answers!

Johnny

Well I would say the premise is a bit silly, and I hope the answer would be none would be flown out. If you only had 24 hours the focus should be on securing what you can and ensuring staff and families are are safe. No sense on risking lives and aircraft on a chance they could be fired up and flown to safety.

I propose a better hypothetical question is what US museum aircraft could be made airworthy with minimal effort? Which ones really just need a "servicing", not a major overhaul.

In that vein I would say very few are ready to fly at the national museums. Although aircraft may be restored to exacting, like new standards, they are not ready to fly. They may not be properly rigged, balanaced and certified for flight. Fuel, air and hydrualic lines would be a major area of concern. Some preservation oils/fluids are not the same as flight fluids.

I would put the best odds on aircraft that were semi-recently flown at private museums but have been largely static, and aircraft that were flown right to the museums and basically parked as time capsules. The more recent the better: the Pave Low and C-17#1 as more recent time capsule arrivals at the Air force musem, Udvar Hazy has a few like the FedEx bizjet, The EC-121 & Privateer to Yanks, several in the Weeks collection that have not recently flown, etc, etc.

Indoor aircraft have better odds than outdoor display aircraft.

Next down would be aircraft that have been restored to very exacting standards but not flown- Enola Gay is perhaps an example. In theory she is almost there.

I would put much lower odds on aircraft that have sat for decades. No matter how well they have been looked after fabrics, lines, and structures degrade; seals, tanks and rubber crack, electronic corrode. You are looking and a major overhaul- not a servicing. You are not going to crank up the Spirit of St. Loius and fly her off the mall with a servicing.

I would say very few at the main Smithsonian could be ready with a servicing. Perhaps Voyager, the round the world jet ranger, a few others.

Also need to remember that some museum aircraft have military gear removed and parts replaced with time expired, non-flight certified parts such as engines, props etc to keep the remaining fleet going.

Don't mean to throw a wet blanket on your dream- it is a fun mental exercise

[tulsaboy]

I would guess that it's possible that some of the NMUSAF collection, which was flown there, could theoretically be flight prepped if they had to do it. But it would be sheer dumb luck if they were able to get them started on 24 hours notice, much less flown. And then you have the problem of having qualified pilots who are willing to fly those aircraft on such short notice. Who do you have climb into Bock's Car and fire it up?

I would also assume that some of the aircraft at the Smithsonian could fly, as some of the aircraft at Udvar-Hazy flew in to Dulles and were stored there awaiting completion of the facility. And some of those, like the Dash-80, wouldn't be any big deal to find a pilot for. Others here were involved in the restoration of the Enola Gay, which was restored with as accurately period hardware as it could be. But whether or not you could just "gas it up and fly it" is another question. And then you have the same problem- who do you get to fly it, how far are you willing to fly it, and do you trust that it's all going to go ok? The aircraft at the mall would have to be trucked out, unless you could use the National Mall as a grass runway. And even then, most couldn't. The Spirit of St. Louis might be able to fly, the Ford Tri-Motor could probably fly as it was flown to DC and then trucked over, and Earhart's Lockheed may be able to if they reconnected everything when they reassembled it for display. But in all of those cases you are taking a colossal risk. Most of the stuff at the Mall would be a total loss. The vast bulk of it isn't flyable in any way, shape or form. All of the rockets, space capsules, etc. would be gone. If you could lower the Spirit, Ford, Boeing 247, and Eastern Airlines DC-3 from the ceiling, you might be able to fly off the mall IF they were assembled right and IF they would start.

Fun question to ponder. One that should probably be considered by the major museums. The reality, though, is that the major museums would probably be much better off with a strong plan to "duck and cover" and to protect in place as best they could. They may even have just such a plan. An Atlantic hurricane could devestate DC, and tornadoes could do a world of hurt to NMUSAF. Just my 2 cents.

kevin

[Triplane102]

I get 100% what you are saying, & yes, that's too bad SO MANY in museums would be lost because there would be no way to make them airworthy in time. BUT, on the Bright Side ALL of the Cuban outside warbirds would STILL be in Perfect Shape ! Sorry! Sorry! Just Had To GO There!

[Courier Sportster]

My version of daydreaming on this topic is wondering if Kermit Weeks and crew was able to fly anything to safety back in 1992? I find these coastal collections of rare aircraft to just be asking for trouble. Now would be a good time for a pic from the tornado that wiped out the Peacekeeper fleet. No time to escape that one! Or more relatively recently, that aircraft carrier museum that had alot of aircraft damage. In a whole nuther fear-of-damage-to-collections, i'm worried about USA-hating terrorists or peaceniks (enola gay paint thrower-types) wanting to blow up or somehow embarrass a museum. Avenge! Our proudly displayed wartime trophies are just begging for it. NMUSAF is wide open, except for the bus-ride onto base, which is WIDE SHUT. I don't worry at all about Annex...just try it, punk.

[SaxMan]

I'm sure many planes in museums could be brought to an airworthy standard, but precious few with 24 hours notice. Maybe if it was an asteroid where there was going to be several weeks or months notice it would be possible. Then again, if there was an asteroid on a collision course with earth, the human race would probably have bigger issues than saving aircraft in a museum.

[k5083]

We need to start preparing vintage warplanes for combat pretty quickly. It seems to be increasingly an article of consensus among futurists that computers will become self-aware, and when they do, it will take them no more than a few seconds to conclude that we humans do not fit into their plans and another couple of hours to enlist our advanced weapons, cars, HVAC systems, microwave ovens and everything else with a silicon chip connected to the "internet of things" to kill just about all of us. The plucky ragtag bands of survivors will need all the unconnected, pre-silicon machines and weapons they can get. We'll need to pull those P-51s and Sabres out of the museums and get them operational just like BSG's Mk.2 Vipers, and we won't have much time.

August

[Triplane102]

August, No Worry , the friendly PCs will "Print Out" any fighter we want! One Fully Armed P-51!coming up!

[Nathan]

Not a silly question, I've daydreamed this too. But not for natural disasters but more what if we need to fight against alien invaders! Our new jet warplanes would be wiped out, so we would have to fight with our ww2 birds.!

[Mark Allen M]

We need to start preparing vintage warplanes for combat

Already been done ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2DAry5gaY0

[SaxMan]

We need to start preparing vintage warplanes for combat

Already been done ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2DAry5gaY0

You had to go there....

[Mark Allen M]

I had to come back ... and respond to your ... "You had to go there" ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3Oa2tLrWqY

[p51]

We need to start preparing vintage warplanes for combat

Already been done ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2DAry5gaY0

You had to go there....

How many of you have read the book, "Grey Eagles"? Must reading for anyone here. Would make a great movie, I'd think.

[Chris Brame]

In some cases it really depends on the quality and time period of the restoration. Two examples: The P-35 at the NMUSAF was being restored to airworthy condition to be flown in for display in the early '70s; that was changed at the last minute but supposedly all it needed was the fuel tank cleaned and some control cables replaced. The O-46 which was restored around the same time (by Purdue University) apparently has some structural corrosion issues that prevented the airworthy restoration they wanted to perform.

Of course, Shoo Shoo Shoo Baby was flown to Wright-Pat in 1988; wonder if they might try to fly it to the Smithsonian when the time comes?

[marine air]

Suggest you look up the events that lead up to the Lone Star Flight Museum in Galveston Texas taking a direct hit by hurricane. It also got hit by a tidal surge. Many aircraft were flyable, only a few got flown out.
Another example was the Weeks Air Museum in Miami which got hit by Hurricane Andrew. Almost every aircraft received damage, some were crushed and mangled. They had Boeing P-12, Douglas B-23 dragon, and many others that could've been flown out , maybe.
Someone mentioned the Air Force museums P-35. It is missing wiring and would need a complete new rewire. Also, some of the aircraft in the Smithsonian are close to being airworthy. Visited twice last year. The PT-13 needs air in it's tires and it flew in a few years ago. the Boeing 307 could be flown out, as could the XF-35. Many of the small civilian aircraft were flown there.