This is the place where the majority of the warbird (aircraft that have survived military service) discussions will take place. Specialized forums may be added in the new future
Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:15 am
Hi all
Many of you here on this forum will recall my questions and research regarding my own P-39 Project. after alot of book reading, archives collecting followed by late nights etc, I managed to identify my Cobra. As a result of all this research I managed to translate the Bell construction number sequence for the early contracts and convert those to corresponding US serial numbers. After my story appeared in the Classic Wings magazine I was fortunate enough to receive several requests for assistance in identifying other P-39 remains. One such collection of parts, which is nothing more than the twisted and scorched remains of a P-39 that has obviously lost the fight with gravity, these parts would hardly fill the space in my 6x4 ute tray (Pick up for our US friends). Nevertheless, the request was made to try and identify the remains.
My first reaction was 'why bother'. I try to stick to my purist beliefs that an aircrafts identity is something more than an ID plate. I have argued many times before that something substantial should remain before an ID can be claimed. In relation to the P-39, the most dominat feature is the roll over section, which also houses the ID plates etc. If these are missing then I usually look for other identifying features. So I commenced my research into this pile of P-39 remains, eventually discovering a series of numbers not unlike those I located on my own Cobra. Armed with this information I commenced to reverse engineer the construction numbering process. I eventually settled on the US serial number of 41-7119. I was quite happy with this discovery because it turns out this particular P-39 is in fact an 'F' model, of which just over 220 were built.
Being the cautious type I am coupled with the formal research training I have undertaken over many years, I decided to confirm or deny my findings by asking another party to conduct some inquiries to check that my methodology was correct. Some time later, after numerous emails and checking and double checking of details, my initial findings were confirmed. The remains I have belonged to 41-7119, being a model 15B F-1-BE USAAF Contract AC15675 13/09/40. What came next was a total surprise.
While checking my own US serial number records I thought I read that this particular P-39 was handed over to the Royal Australian Air Force (RAAF) as part of a consignment of 20 in 1942. It is not widely known that Australia operated the P-39 albeit for a short period of time, and to my knowledge, all examples of the RAAF P-39 were either returned to the USAAF or were destroyed in accidents. Regardless of this, I had the remains of 41-7119, which corresponds to RAAF P-39 A53-1. This I had to confirm and once again I sought advice and feedback from a very reliable P-39 and RAAF researcher in Gordon Birkett, who by chance has already done a lot of research into P-39's that came to Australia. My discovery was confirmed. 41-7119 was in fact A53-1 but was lost due to an accident when the engined failed in flight with Pilot abandoning a/c over South Luddenham, near Sydney Australia.W/O RAAF 08/03/43.TTHrs 140.55
Further research indicates this aircraft was converted to components and this would explain how the remains came to be collected and stored for over 60 years. Its clear the intention of the original collector was to either add these parts to a pile of others or to sell them for scrap. Either way the remains were saved and are now in my possession, acting as custodian for the true owner who is currently coming to terms with this latest dicovery. While I have mentioned being a purist and personally demanding a high standard of originality, I would concede that I may be some what short sighted when it comes to Warbird identification. The significance of this P-39 and its connection to the RAAF during WW2 can not be ignored and nor should it be, whether its a ute full of scattered parts or a more significant chunk of Airacobra. If I have any say in the final outcome I will lobby to have this become the basis of a restoration to whatever standard. It would be a great thing to achieve getting a P-39 built and being able to say it has some providence to the original and at least, it would be something more than a change in data plates.
I would like to thank G.Birkett for his assistance in this research and hope to be able to update this forum, which I hold in high regard, with decisions and outcomes on this latest significant find.
thanks
Digger
Sat Mar 11, 2006 7:27 am
Hi mate
That really is exiting news. You never know where a load of apparent junk is going to lead you. I can understand your viewpoint of initially believing that something substantial should constitute a wreck, especially since you're working so hard on your bird but, as you found, even "scrap" can have history. Congratulations on a wonderful find. Let me know if I can help in anyway.
Did you and GO work out a deal?
Cheers
Andy
Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:01 pm
That is great news Digger!! I have followed your investigations into this
bird with much anticipation of your next posts. Glad to see you were
rewarded handsomely for your efforts in the discovery of a rare veteran.
Sun Mar 12, 2006 4:58 am
Hi Digger
Great work mate.
I completely agree with you about the fate of this - Just a thought. The RAAF M is rebuilding a lot or their P40 from scratch (At least Precision areospace is building the wings)
I would have thought the P39 would make a great basis for a P39 for them ? A good home and as Precision are turning out P39 bits - perhaps a good opportunity?
Just my thoughts
Regards
John P
Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:25 am
Digger...Good on ya', mate. Your focus on this project is definitely commendable.
Just as an FYI....We have an Aussie Shepherd whose name is...you guessed it...DIGGER.
There are those un-educated people who think he's named that because he like to dig. Then I have to 'splain the name to them. I usually get a blank stare and an "Oh, OK".
I'd tell you the story about my father being based in Perth in WWII, but it'd probably bore you to death.
Mudge the impressed
Sun Mar 12, 2006 6:06 pm
Thanks Everyone for the feedback
Yes its been a bit of work, but as I said I had a lot of help, hence my comments about this forum etc. This result is a good example of how this,
and other forums can help preserve history!.
I'm still learning on how to do this type of research. Thats one thing thats come out of this little excercise and I realise now there are many more researchers out there who have done so much to ensure military records are maintained and put onto the eletronic systems for everyone to enjoy.
Without these people I suspect A53-1 would have remained a pile of unidentifiable parts and possibly lost forever.
The name digger was given to me by a group of people who got to know that I was doing a lot of 'digging' around, in the physical and research sense. Its in my nature to chase every rabbit down every hole to ensure I can present the best information.
John, I didn't know about the RAAF museum side of things but, its fate will be in the hands of the owner. I personally think it should be a project for someone but as we can all appreciate, its a big job and would take enormous resources.
Moving onto my next research topic, which oddly enough, is identifying more P-39's!
cheers
Digger
Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:35 pm
Mudge
I wouldn't mind hearing about your Dad's experiences in Perth, given that's where I live!
An Aussie Shepherd just won the big dog show as "Best In Show" in the UK, I think.
Cheers
Andy
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