Warbird Information Exchange

Several years ago, while restoring a TA-4J, I bid on a package of parts from five (5) TA-4J aircraft at Davis Monthan ... and won the bid. I am now almost 5 years trying to get my parts from the private contractor, (Government Liquidators), that the government uses to "dispose" of aircraft and parts. They spent months whittling down the parts list to nothing but lightbulbs and transformers (eg. "You can have the right main landing gear, but not the left ..." -- why? -- "national security reasons"), then, in the face of a restraining order, they ground up all five aircraft. Judge then issued an injunction and 5 more aircraft locked up until settled. Then DC court said even if they found in our favor re. the parts, they didn't feel they could "force" the government give us the parts, and ruled against us (!) ... Off to DC court of Appeals who found in favor of all of our arguments ... and now back to DC court to retry our case.

One argument of the government is that they have NEVER sold an A-4 out of Davis Monthan ... which may be true (except for ours, which WAS purchased at auction there by another owner!) ... I am trying to find examples of any aircraft sold to private individuals out of DM that we might use to show the purchase of our parts was not that "unusual" ...

Also, if you bought any parts at DM that have been used on jet aircraft, that might also help our case.

Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks!

Rich Sugden M.D.
Jackson, WY

_________________
Fly safe ... and often!

Rich,
Welcome to Wix. You might talk to Bill Muzalla in Tucson as he had several A-4s that came from DM. Unfortunately you are dealing with a Govt that is more afraid of citizens using their toys than they are of another country. In recent years they have demanded that used rifle brass be destroyed rather than being reused, wanted to ban the sale of ammo cans. I recent years there were several T-33s that came up for sale, with the provision that they be shredded.

_________________
Matt Gunsch, A&P, IA, Warbird maint and restorations
Jack, You have Debauched my sloth !!!!!!
We tried voting with the Ballot box, When do we start voting from the Ammo box, and am I allowed only one vote ?
Check out the Ercoupe Discussion Group on facebook

Rich, did you have any relatives in the Coast Guard? John

i think this guy had 20+ at one stage now i think 5 http://www.raptoraviation.com/aircraft% ... s/A_4.html

Rich is talking about aircraft bought or released directly from AMARC. The A-4 Ls and Cs you guys are speaking of were originally released to Malaysia, it took 20+ years for them to wind up on the civil market.

Rich is fighting DoD policy, not law. I believe this activity by Govt. bureaucrats rises to the level of knowing malfeasance of the IRS, ATF and VA. Nothing will come of their lawless actions.

_________________
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass..."
Admiral Isoruku Yamamoto

Doc, PM sent.

Tom P.

About 4-5 years ago there was an auction on the government liquidators site for 5-7 Cessna O-2's (337's) where there was no requirement for shredding before removal. I am not sure what ever happened with the auction, but maybe there is a way to look it up on an auction history part of their webpage? I have looked to see if there was any threads here about it, but could not find anything with the search function. Not sure who if anyone bought them, but maybe some of the 337 owners/operators remembers more details, or even saved a copy of the auction.

There are several levels of complexity difference between a O-2 and an A-4, but it would show that they have indeed sold aircraft. Judging from the timing mentioned in the original post, it may have been right around the same time as these O-2's.

Where did Fighting Classics Aircraft Restoration get their A-4s from?
http://fightingclassics.com/projects-3.

Ken, many people bought O-2s directly from auctions at AMARC. The difference is the same difference you and I have watching and fighting for years. The DoD dis-qualifiers are turbine or tactical.

Maj got his A-4s same as everybody Malaysian A-4Cs or reworked Ls.

_________________
"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind each blade of grass..."
Admiral Isoruku Yamamoto

Someone privately owns a F-8 Crusader in Texas that was clearly at AMARC. How ever he got to buy that, is a real mystery. He was apparently and ex-Navy pilot. Perhaps he had pull to get it? Either way it now sits derelict on the edge of a farm field.


I think a better idea to get an airplane rather then go to AMARCD is to try and save a few that the USAFM has on loan to towns, city halls, VFWs, etc. These can be bought if the organizations want to part with them.

_________________
Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com

No they can't. They are still owned by the NMUSAF. If you buy one and start working on it you will quickly find yourself having an unhappy conversation....

As we have seen before, the NMUSAF is happy to scrap an aircraft before they let others have it...case and point the Kenosha F-84F which was featured in photos being scrapped on this very site.

There are a few crusaders out there - FHC has one or two IIRC. They were originally purchased by a group intending to fly them in the adversary role like Draken Int'l or ATSI but then as I was told the funding was just not there - this is second hand so I might be up the wrong tree. Someone here doubtless knows more. . .

Tom P.

Thanks Tim for the correction. I should have been more clear and stated these could be transferred to other parties interested in preserving them. That was what I meant, Plus some of these aircraft were bought through DOD sales.

_________________
Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com