CAF's JU 52

Pogo · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:25 pm

I've seen an awful lot of GA strips go away, and it HURTS. But I have to believe it's simply a money thing. People can bitch all they want about noise or whatever, but if the airports were pumping in millions of dollars per day, do you really think they'd go away? :roll:

I think this thread may be a contender for a record for sheer number of different directions in which it has been hijacked. :shock:

bluehawk15 · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:55 pm

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but one reason other units of the CAF didn't pick up the Ju-52 is that it was difficult to generate income with. You do good to break even taking a plane to an air show. The money to support the larger planes comes from financial "angels" (which seem to be fading fast), the pockets of members (which are not as deep as they once were), or selling rides. The rides are the best source of revenue, but my understanding is that we are restricted to American built aircraft. The Ju-52, being foreign built, didn't qualify for the ride-for-hire exemption, so no unit wanted to pick it up. I believe it's aircraft account might have been in the red.

Nathan · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 8:18 pm

Just an observation here but, Geneseo, National Warplane museum, Air Heritage, air zoo all went down hill at one point. I can start seeing the same trends they showed before collapsing that the CAF is going through now. This comment has nothing to do with the selling of the "52". Just dont see the CAF as it once was. Its tough to come out of a hole.

Re-hijacking the thread for team blue! :butthead:

Taylor Stevenson · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:02 pm

bluehawk15 wrote:

The Ju-52, being foreign built, didn't qualify for the ride-for-hire exemption, so no unit wanted to pick it up.

You're correct. Registered Experimental which means no rides for hire, therefor the only way to make an airshow buck is through appearance fees and lets all be realistic here, Joe Blow airshow attendee would rather see the famous D-Day C-47s and not some weird looking foreign aircraft. Three R-1340s is a lot of gas for a unit to not be reimbursed for. I did not want to see the aircraft be sold, but recently that has been a direction for a few of the a/c sitting in MAF. I don't like it, but at least it's going to someone who will do her right!

Scott Apple · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:04 pm

We (The AZ Wing) tried to get some intrest from the membership and a plan to sponsor the Ju-52. We just weren't able to come up with a plan financially to make it work. We supported the He-111 for a decade without selling rides, but it was easier to generate revenue back then with t-shirt sales and tours through the airplane, and touring with the B-17. The Ju-52 would have been tough to generate revenue and be self sufficient. I am glad to hear the Ju-52 will be going to a good home!

Taylor Stevenson · **Posted:** Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:27 pm

Also easier to raise funds / show fees / overall interest with a bomber (HE-111) than a transport (JU-52). That HE sure was cool... ya'll did a good job with her back then...

Scott Apple · **Posted:** Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:18 am

Thanks! It was a great experience getting to work with such a rare airplane. Alot of good memories!

bluehawk15 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:33 am

Taylor,

Being in the Experimental category doesn't exempt an aircraft from the Ride program, but I think being foreign built might. Fifi is registered as Experimental, but she is listed in our exemption (6802H), which allows the CAF to operate the "Ride for Hire" program.

Taylor Stevenson · **Posted:** Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:48 am

My mistake. Rest still applies.

TonyM · **Posted:** Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:49 am

I am a member of the Great Lakes Wing CAF and we--until recently--had operated the JU-52.

The Swastika Issue
We had overcome the swastika problem at Gary Airport, Gary, Indiana (GYY) many years ago by covering up the swastika with a removable panel that clipped into place; the panels were removed for flight. We ran into our most recent problems when we tried to move the Great Lakes Wing CAF to Lansing Municipal Airport, Lansing, Illinois (IGQ). Some coward (he can't be anything else since he acted anonymously) wrote anonymous letters to the Mayor of Lansing, the FBO operator, local politicians and the local newspaper, complaining that the airplane was a "Nazi Tribute" airplane and that the CAF members were nazi sympathizers. The local newspaper, at that time, would actually publish anonymous letters to the editor. Well, the paper did a story, we kind of got some bad press and our PIO did a fine job of defending the CAF and its mission to local reporters, but the damage was done and we were asked not to bring the airplane to Lansing (IGQ).

The fact that the airplane could not generate any revenue for our wing certainly hamstrung our efforts to operate the JU-52. And with three engines, it took money to make it go. We were prohibited from giving rides so we could not realize the extra revenue that would come from those types of operations. We in the wing all loved the JU-52 and would have been happy to keep the airplane had it been able to pay its way. It could not. And we could not.

I regret the day that Jim R. had asked me to fly back to base in the JU-52 after a successful airshow. I declined and flew back on board the C-47, the airplane I was a crewmember on that day. I wish I would have taken that last ride in the JU-52.

We all are happy the airplane now has a good home.

TonyM.

Scott Apple · **Posted:** Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:17 am

Sorry guys! I miss spoke in my earlier post on this thread. We (the AZ Wing) did have a game plan and the income to operate the Ju-52, and notified HQ that we would like the reassignment. But they decided to sell it. Not sure if they had a buyer already at that time. And not sure if they formally offered it up for reassignment. Quite a rare piece of history!

Iclo · **Posted:** Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:16 am

It's a bit difficult to understand all the problem who's could occure in USA about the Swastika. In France and Belgium, there is different planes painted with the full original markings including Swastika.
There are sometimes debats but peoples admit that its only historical representation.

The only concerns are for owner who wants to appear in airshow in Germany where the nazi symbols are prohibited (and with good reasons)

Tony C · **Posted:** Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:59 am

gflinch wrote:

Well here I go sticking my neck out and probably firmly planting my foot in my mouth, but here goes.

I understand how some people might be offended, but it is still part of history, much like the confederate flag is to the south, may be offensive to some.

One thing I always think of when this is brought up, people have to look at it from everyones perspective (if only = world peace?? joke maybe), what do native american indians think of the american flag? This was probably carried by Custard on his campaigns as well as many others that faught with indians. However I wouldn't think of anyone taking down thier american flag as to not offend native americans. So even though the nazi emblem may have some conitations towards some groups, but not all germans were nazis, most german soldiers fought for their side to keep thier homeland too, and this was thir countrys symbole at that time.

Anyhow, I am not trying to be insensitive to any group, nor am I trying to make some slanted political view, this is just my 2 cent observation. Personally, anymore many people go out of thier way TO BE offended.

Thanks for reading, and not reading anything into this.

Greg

Well, people complained about having naked women painted on aircraft, am I right in saying that people complaining about Enola Gay being put on public display, so are we really surprised that some muppets are going to complain about a swastika?

After all, history is only a commodity that can be changed to our own perspective so here's an idea, lets forget about everything that's ever happened before 01 January 2000, so that we can have the experience of going through it all again!

You know, the more I know about the human race, the more I wish to retire from it! :roll:

rreis · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:42 pm **Posts:** 441

Tony C wrote:

You know, the more I know about the human race, the more I wish to retire from it! :roll:

bluehawk15 · **Posted:** Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:21 am

Amen Calvin! (sure miss him!!)

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CAF's JU 52

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