Mystery B-17

Tiger Tim · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:29 am

Could the pic be from the production of a movie? Apart from the nose art and mission markings the paint job looks very civilian.

-Tim

Pathfinder · **Joined:** Tue Nov 10, 2009 7:35 pm **Posts:** 587

I make it 119 bomb mission marks...the top row is 41...below that is 17 and each row below that is minus 2 of the row above. 15...13...11...9...7...5... Also note one mark above the navigators window....total 119.

Whatever the plane is named in the photo the mission tally should put her in a relatively exclusive fraternity.

Is there something written on or inside the big bomb by the door? What is the significance of the big 7?

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 9:30 am

Found a 385th BG ship with 119 missions, but Baugher shows it at Kingman in Dec 1945, probably too soon for a troop carrier.

Steve

Jiggersfromsphilly · **Joined:** Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:15 pm **Posts:** 951

bipe215 wrote:

Found a 385th BG ship with 119 missions, but Baugher shows it at Kingman in Dec 1945, probably too soon for a troop carrier.

Steve

My father flew home from the ETO via North Africa to Brazil in July of 1945 in a B-17. He was a High Points man. So the fact that it was in Kingman by Dec is not out of reach.

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:01 am

There were a lot of B-17's rotated home fairly early and most of those came home with turrets in place. The birds specifically outfitted for troop carry were stripped like this one and were probably some of the last ones home (although I'm sure there were exceptions). I think the majority of the troop carriers flew missions just hauling troops to port for the long voyage home by ship. That's what Dad did for quite a while, flew from Pisa to Casablanca with a one day layover then back to Pisa.
Its just hard to believe a B-17 with this many missions and distinctive nose art doesn't show up anywhere. Sure wish we could read what that hatch says!

Steve

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:04 am

Jiggersfromsphilly wrote:

bipe215 wrote:

Found a 385th BG ship with 119 missions, but Baugher shows it at Kingman in Dec 1945, probably too soon for a troop carrier.

Steve

My father flew home from the ETO via North Africa to Brazil in July of 1945 in a B-17. He was a High Points man. So the fact that it was in Kingman by Dec is not out of reach.

What was your Dad's route to get to North Africa?

Pathfinder · **Joined:** Tue Nov 10, 2009 7:35 pm **Posts:** 587

bipe--

If you have the original photo just scan the hatch section at around 1000 dpi and it should tighten up the print.

A great-uncle of mine (5th Army) came back from the MTO in a B-17. He was one of the last men to board and the plane was jammed full so he kept walking forward til he found a big empty space "the size of three king sized beds" and not another body anywhere around! He threw his duffle in there and "slept all the way back to the States".

When he related this great find to the crew chief after landing he was told that it was a good thing the pilot didn't decide to "air the plane out over the Atlantic" since Uncle Jimmy had decided to camp out on the bomb bay doors.

Jiggersfromsphilly · **Joined:** Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:15 pm **Posts:** 951

bipe215 wrote:

Jiggersfromsphilly wrote:

bipe215 wrote:

Found a 385th BG ship with 119 missions, but Baugher shows it at Kingman in Dec 1945, probably too soon for a troop carrier.

Steve

My father flew home from the ETO via North Africa to Brazil in July of 1945 in a B-17. He was a High Points man. So the fact that it was in Kingman by Dec is not out of reach.

What was your Dad's route to get to North Africa?

I have his log that he wrote in a Homeward Bound pamphlet .

Ist Res/ Marseilles to Casablanca, B-17, 1000 miles, 5&1/2 Hours.
Casablanca to Dakar, C-54, 1451 Miles,7&1/2 hours.
Dakar to Parnamir Field Brazil, C-54, 1888 Miles. 9 & 1/2 hours
Natal to Belem C-47, 981 Miles, 5&1/2 hours.
Belem to Belem, C-47, 350 Miles, 3 hours
Belem to Georgetown,C-47 850 Miles 6 & 1/4 Hours
Georgetown to Puerto Rico, C-47, 1150 Miles, 6 & 1/4 hours
Puerto Rico to Miami,C-47, 1003 Miles, 5 & 1/2 Hours.

That is what he wrote. Unfortunately he passed away in 1968 so I can't ask him more about the details. In the log he has some notes about losing a motor out of Belem and returning .The back page with his notes is missing.

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:41 am

Pathfinder wrote:

bipe--

If you have the original photo just scan the hatch section at around 1000 dpi and it should tighten up the print.

A great-uncle of mine (5th Army) came back from the MTO in a B-17. He was one of the last men to board and the plane was jammed full so he kept walking forward til he found a big empty space "the size of three king sized beds" and not another body anywhere around! He threw his duffle in there and "slept all the way back to the States".

When he related this great find to the crew chief after landing he was told that it was a good thing the pilot didn't decide to "air the plane out over the Atlantic" since Uncle Jimmy had decided to camp out on the bomb bay doors.

I'll try that tonight. Great story about your uncle!

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:46 am

Jiggers,

That's neat that you have that pamphlet. My Dad passed away two years ago and I so miss just sitting and talking to him. Can't believe I never asked him about this particular B-17.

Steve

Jiggersfromsphilly · **Joined:** Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:15 pm **Posts:** 951

bipe215 wrote:

Jiggers,

That's neat that you have that pamphlet. My Dad passed away two years ago and I so miss just sitting and talking to him. Can't believe I never asked him about this particular B-17.

Steve

Isn't that the truth. I have a ton of photos that my Dad took during WW2 and Korea and I don't know who any of the persons are in them. There are some from The Battle of the Bulge that I would love to know where they were taken. In the booklet he later wrote down his flight home from Korea during 1951 .

CoastieJohn · **Joined:** Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:37 pm **Posts:** 1380

Quote:

Dakar to Parnamir Field Brazil, C-54, 1888 Miles. 9 & 1/2 hours

That's a long leg over no man's land.

About 3 years ago one of our Casa HC-144's was hopping from Spain to the US and crossing the Atlantic down that way and lost one of the two turboprops about several hours out of Brazil, still over the Atlantic. Needless to say there was a scramble and a few white knuckles till they safely landed.

bipe215 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 7:41 pm

Triangle,

That photo sure looks like the same treatment. Notice the dark engine nacelles match the 'Helyn Ann' also. In looking at Dad's logbook, he flew to Istres on 5-3, 5-17 and 6-4-46. The latter being his last flight as a B-17 pilot. His entries for those flight were listed as 'ferrying' and 'courier' flights.
Thanks so much for the help!

Steve

PS There were several bomb groups involved in the 'Green Project' in both the 8th and 15AF. I know the 2nd and 483rd were for sure.

gtokid · **Posted:** Tue Feb 21, 2012 10:01 pm

This is just a guess, but it looks like the hatch says: "THE GOLDEN GATE" with a picture of the bridge drawn next to it.

Todd

aerovin · **Posted:** Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:59 am

It looks to me like the nose glass is also the longer version used on the "F" without the turret. More elongated and rounded. A bit strange but possibly a replacement part pulled out and fitted in a pinch.

Warbird Information Exchange

Mystery B-17

Who is online