intact G4M Betty still standing on her gear in jungle

DaveM2 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:50 pm

kalamazookid wrote:

I may be mistaken, but I thought Mr. Harada was building up a full replica of a Betty.

He has built a forward fuse from scratch and mated it to his largely original rear fuselage. Recently fitted turrets and replica guns. Update with photos in the latest CW

DaveM2 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:03 pm

davidwomacks wrote:

If the locals care so much about it why isn't it sitting in a hanger if they pooled thier money they could build one in fact they should and either leave the plane as it is in it or re clear the airstrip and restore the buildings get a few replica (t-6s) and open a really cool museum.

A dose of reality would help. Solomon Islanders make a subsistence living, mostly through trade and bartering for goods they grow or get from the jungle. What they make in a lifetime 'money' wise, you make in a week. I am sure a 'cool' museum isn't a priority when you are living day to day.

John Dupre · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:11 pm

davidwomacks wrote:

Not to be rude to the folks on those islands but the planes don't really belong to them the planes belong to Japan and if you want to get technical they really belong to the US since Japan handed the remains of thier airforce over to the US when the war ended. .

I think legally all former war material left in places like the Solomons became the property of the governments there. As well the Solomons islanders and the citizens of all Japanese occupied territories bore the brunt of the thier vicious rule after we and our allies abandoned them. What was a strategic withdrawal for us left them in deep with a deadly racist imperialism far worse than anything they had known before. It may be a shame that these people are not so eager to sell these relics to us but that is their right like it or not. Many of them also understand they were collectively fleeced back in the 60s and 70s by some of the pioneering warbird types and aren't about to let that happen again.

Taylor Stevenson · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:44 pm

Is it too bad of me that if I recovered and restored a Betty, I'd still paint it in white surrender colors? You don't see too many photos of them without such a scheme...

DaveM2 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 11:49 pm

Actually, just remembered that in #64 (2007) we did an article on Solomons recoveries, these being several Pete floatplanes and the remains of a Zero fom Ballae by Aussie Craig Turner in conjunction with the Council of Chiefs, along with the National Museum of the Solomons. All part of an initiative to help grow the Solomons Museum in a trade type scenario.
Several individuals (outsiders) tried to derail these plans.
These wrecks were eventually recovered, we ran a photos of them in the 'wild' and a Pete in store afterward.
We also included a shot of a Betty with a tree fallen through the top of the fuselage, and there was a report of another totally destroyed in similar circumstances nearby- not sure if the Youtube Betty is either of those.
The change of Govt later that and the interferance from the 'leave them rot' brigade curtailed further recoveries AFAIK. I haven't chased an update so don't know the status of the recovered wrecks-but at least they are out of harms way.

davidwomacks · **Joined:** Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:34 pm **Posts:** 195

I hate to see history rot and I know that they can't all be saved but I'd sure like to try. If I ever win the lotto my neighbours are gonna hate me since my front yard would look like Davis Mothans haha. I don't understand the mindset of the leave them rot folks, just leaving them there it's a waste of history!

Flying Pencil · **Joined:** Sun May 04, 2008 11:31 am **Posts:** 161

DaveM2 wrote:

davidwomacks wrote:

If the locals care so much about it why isn't it sitting in a hanger if they pooled thier money they could build one in fact they should and either leave the plane as it is in it or re clear the airstrip and restore the buildings get a few replica (t-6s) and open a really cool museum.

A dose of reality would help. Solomon Islanders make a subsistence living, mostly through trade and bartering for goods they grow or get from the jungle. What they make in a lifetime 'money' wise, you make in a week. I am sure a 'cool' museum isn't a priority when you are living day to day.

So what is so hard about paying them something in exchange for the Betty?

Nuts.

DaveM2 · **Posted:** Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:55 pm

Flying Pencil wrote:

DaveM2 wrote:

davidwomacks wrote:

If the locals care so much about it why isn't it sitting in a hanger if they pooled thier money they could build one in fact they should and either leave the plane as it is in it or re clear the airstrip and restore the buildings get a few replica (t-6s) and open a really cool museum.

A dose of reality would help. Solomon Islanders make a subsistence living, mostly through trade and bartering for goods they grow or get from the jungle. What they make in a lifetime 'money' wise, you make in a week. I am sure a 'cool' museum isn't a priority when you are living day to day.

So what is so hard about paying them something in exchange for the Betty?

Nuts.

Paying who? It isn't a matter of rocking up to the nearest village and handing out $$ or KFC vouchers. Look at how many years it took to get Swamp Ghost out. The Western mindset doesn't apply and other Westerners running interference just makes it even more difficult. But really, unless you have sat down and listened to anyone who has actually been there and done that, it isn't something that can be explained on a forum.

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:20 pm

DaveM2 wrote:

But really, unless you have sat down and listened to anyone who has actually been there and done that, it isn't something that can be explained on a forum.

Well then how will the majority of us actually understand since we probably will never visit that area of the world?

davidwomacks · **Joined:** Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:34 pm **Posts:** 195

What if you paid the locals for it for it and had it loaded on a waiting cargo ship and ran for international waters before anyone could stop you. Would the US Gov prevent the import?

CoastieJohn · **Joined:** Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:37 pm **Posts:** 1380

Just for grins, I was scanning thru Google Earth in the Solomon Islands. There's a few WWII planes out there in the jungles...Japanese and US.

DoraNineFan · **Joined:** Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:37 pm **Posts:** 678

davidwomacks wrote:

What if you paid the locals for it for it and had it loaded on a waiting cargo ship and ran for international waters before anyone could stop you. Would the US Gov prevent the import?

You've got a little more paperwork to do than just asking for a receipt.

Yes the US Gov can take your new toy away if you don't follow legitimate methods, if a lesson is to be learned from a certain French Skyraider.

maradamx3 · **Posted:** Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:40 am

I'm wondering who went in and gutted the aircraft? And when? Japanese? Locals? Treasure hunters? People involved with the Zero removal? Was she stripped shortly after the "landing" or has this been a 70 year long gradual stripping?
Thanks!

DoraNineFan · **Joined:** Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:37 pm **Posts:** 678

maradamx3 wrote:

I'm wondering who went in and gutted the aircraft? And when? Japanese? Locals? Treasure hunters? People involved with the Zero removal? Was she stripped shortly after the "landing" or has this been a 70 year long gradual stripping?
Thanks!

All of the above.

Look at most of the accessible aircraft in the Pacific and you can see that they have been picked apart (or sometimes hacked apart) by locals for anything useful or to sell scrap, or souvenir hunters.

Ballale Airfield was abandoned by the Japanese in 1943, leaving all non-flyable airframes. It was later occupied by the Australians after the war.

There was an initial wave of scrap cleanup into the 1950s in the Pacific Islands. Logging crews coming in later have also disturbed abandoned aircraft.

Obergrafeter · **Posted:** Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:04 am

Looks like you could trade a couple of cartons of cigarettes to the locals for it.

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intact G4M Betty still standing on her gear in jungle

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