New Spielberg miniseries on 8th Air Force to cost HALF A BIL

[StangStung]

I really hope its done well and is successful. One of my biggest rants among close friends following "Red Tails" was that there were an incredible number of other units who did incredible things, but had never received the same level of media attention.

I'm genuinely hoping this project will change that to some extent.

-Brandon

I've never understood this gripe. The fact is that they can't make a movie about every unit. Sure they were all heros as far as I am concerned and there were hundreds of storeis out there that would be wonderful to tell but most of these guys like Captain Winters and Jimmy Doolittle were humble guys that would tell you that they were no hero. The fact is that it is an expensive undertaking making these films and the goal is to make the biggest profit possible and if they can through a little accuracy and a good story in there too it might happen. I'm happy that there are people willing to gather a half a billion to make a reasonably interesting movie as opposed to the rest of the garbage out here which is almost unwatchable.

Ryan

^^^^This. So much.

The reason why the unit in Band of Brothers was covered because it was unique - they were there from D-Day until the end. Not a whole lot of other units had the same experience at the tip of the spear - which could be documented by a group of living folks. Recall, Ambrose got the idea for Band of Brothers after attending an Easy Company reunion and realizing it was a unique unit in this way. So when Spielberg and Hanks show up, they realize they could tell the story of one unit on the Western Front from beginning to end - so you didn't have to learn a bunch of characters multiple times - a failing of The Pacific simply due to the nature of the time span covered (years, not months) - and thus give a fairly cohesive overview of the war through the eyes of one unit. Knowing you can't tell each unit's story, finding a unit which may have had stories similar to others and has a timeline like Easy Company is great story telling.

As mentioned, there is no way you can tell each unit's story. Further, it isn't a documentary, it's still entertainment. So how does a STORY TELLER do that? They try and find an actual unit which may touch on issues/storylines similar to those across a wide variety of units.

Spielberg and Hanks work on these series are such a quantum leap in historical accuracy + good story telling, over even good vintage movies like The Big Red One, I can't see how there are complaints. You can't please everyone I suppose.

[Chris Brame]

I'm pretty sure Ben Affleck won WW2.

No, silly, it was John Wayne - he flew with the Flying Tigers, skippered a PT boat, led his troops on D-Day, retook Bataan, captured Iwo Jima in a Corsair, then for good measure simultaneously defeated the Indians, the Viet Cong, and Maureen O'Hara.
And he was also Genghis Khan.

[tom d. friedman]

lol........ a great / funny reply, but john wayne was the definition of a true patriot as cornball as it sounds.

[jtramo]

Love it or hate it Memphis Belle got a lot of iron together. Will the half a billion have a budget for booking a lot of these planes again? Anyone in the B-17 community hear anything?

It would be great if we could get everything (all medium/heavy bomber hands on Deck) together for this along with the inevitable CGI. G models and F models can mingle quite well if it follows a particular timeline.

[Rocketeer]

For the early daylight bombing raids with B-17Fs -

N17W at the Museum of Flight and the MARC B-17 N3703G (although not an "F" model, it very well appears as one) - if their markings were temporarily changed to represent multiple aircraft - would be great candidates

If they wanted to use an "E" model -
Perhaps Serial #: 41-2595 "Tangerine/Desert Rat" could receive sponsorship to complete its restoration to airworthy status if it could utilized in the filming.... (although when complete, it would be nice to see a B-17E in Pacific Theater markings)

[SaxMan]

The 8th AF also has sheer numbers on its side. They had 27 groups of B-17s alone, more groups than some of the Air Forces had of all types. Throw in the 20 something groups of B-24s and all the groups 8th Fighter Command, there are just simply more people to tell the story. Include epic air battles of hundreds, if not thousands of planes, a true good versus evil storyline, fiendish new weapons being fielded by the enemy...it's the stuff that legends are made of.

That's not to say that the 5th Air Force wasn't as courageous, or that the 15th Air Force losses were felt any less keenly. I'm of the opinion that ANY production that may make someone crack a book or want to learn more about this dramatic period in our history is a good thing.

[Punisher05]

I really hope its done well and is successful. One of my biggest rants among close friends following "Red Tails" was that there were an incredible number of other units who did incredible things, but had never received the same level of media attention.

I'm genuinely hoping this project will change that to some extent.

-Brandon

I've never understood this gripe. The fact is that they can't make a movie about every unit. Sure they were all heros as far as I am concerned and there were hundreds of storeis out there that would be wonderful to tell but most of these guys like Captain Winters and Jimmy Doolittle were humble guys that would tell you that they were no hero. The fact is that it is an expensive undertaking making these films and the goal is to make the biggest profit possible and if they can through a little accuracy and a good story in there too it might happen. I'm happy that there are people willing to gather a half a billion to make a reasonably interesting movie as opposed to the rest of the garbage out here which is almost unwatchable.

Ryan

^^^^This. So much.

The reason why the unit in Band of Brothers was covered because it was unique - they were there from D-Day until the end. Not a whole lot of other units had the same experience at the tip of the spear - which could be documented by a group of living folks. Recall, Ambrose got the idea for Band of Brothers after attending an Easy Company reunion and realizing it was a unique unit in this way. So when Spielberg and Hanks show up, they realize they could tell the story of one unit on the Western Front from beginning to end - so you didn't have to learn a bunch of characters multiple times - a failing of The Pacific simply due to the nature of the time span covered (years, not months) - and thus give a fairly cohesive overview of the war through the eyes of one unit. Knowing you can't tell each unit's story, finding a unit which may have had stories similar to others and has a timeline like Easy Company is great story telling.

As mentioned, there is no way you can tell each unit's story. Further, it isn't a documentary, it's still entertainment. So how does a STORY TELLER do that? They try and find an actual unit which may touch on issues/storylines similar to those across a wide variety of units.

Spielberg and Hanks work on these series are such a quantum leap in historical accuracy + good story telling, over even good vintage movies like The Big Red One, I can't see how there are complaints. You can't please everyone I suppose.

Hey guys-

I don't want to rehash the same arguement that caused the original "Red Tails" post to fall apart, so this is just my $0.02 (which may be wrong) and I'll clear out.

I volunteer at a local inner city school that lost its accrediation, and was reestablished by the state as an Aerospace charter school. I spend around 40 hours there a month, teaching about not only the mechanics of flight but also the history of it. A big part of that is me flying RC aircraft demonstrations for the kids (6th-8th grade) and linking history with mechanics using an SE5a, Corsair, and EDF jet.

It never fails that when I get to the Corsair in WWII, and talk about how aircraft technology had developed since WWI, the kids ask if the Corsair "was the one the Red Tails flew." When I explain it was not, and how there was a whole other side of the war in the Pacific, I get blank stares. A few may have heard of Pearl Harbor, but that may be about it. Last week I actually had one ask me why we were fighting the Japanese if we drive Japanese cars.

I know that's a function largely of our education system (prior to me getting to them), but the popular media isn't doing the situation any favors.

Obviously we cannot recognize every unit that participated, though every unit was an important cog in the overall mechanism of victory. Representatives (such as those in Band of Brothers, which I still haven't seen all of yet) do need to be chosen that can tell as much of the story as possible as well as make a profit for the makers, as well as spark an interest in these kids that is otherwise going out as you can see from my first hand experiences.

I just want the ones chosen to be compelling based upon their experiences and performance, without having to deal with any politically correct issues as a result.

As always, I'll be the first to admit that I could be wrong. But I do hope the series does a good job of getting the real story across.

-Brandon

[alang]

I'm surprised, Spiegelburg's father was in the Burma Bridge Busters, a B-25 squadron in the CBI theater. FHC painted their B-25 like a Burma Buster to honor his father because Steven and Paul Allen have a partnership in the DreamWorks.

[Punisher05]

I'm surprised, Spiegelburg's father was in the Burma Bridge Busters, a B-25 squadron in the CBI theater. FHC painted their B-25 like a Burma Buster to honor his father because Steven and Paul Allen have a partnership in the DreamWorks.

You know, that's an interesting point. I always thought a movie about the innovative low-level B-25 squadrons in the CBI and Pacific would be fascinating. Plus we have the airframes to do real-world video in conjunction with CGI.

I'd probably get cable to see that.

-Brandon

[p51]

The reason why the unit in Band of Brothers was covered because it was unique - they were there from D-Day until the end.

Wow, as long as that?
How about all the other units who were there as early as the 1st battles with the Germans, in some cases over two years before that?
Maybe some folks never heard of these obscure units. Outfits maybe no TV fan ever heard of, like, say, the 1st Infantry Division, or the 82nd Airborne?

[Mark Allen M]

IMHO coverage of any group from any theater from anytime is a great thing for recognition to ALL groups from any theater from anytime. To honor one veteran is to honor ALL veterans. I for one am very thankful for the folks who put in the time and $$$$$ to create these series, movies, documentaries etc. They may not come out all rosy at times but the effort to bring awareness to the sacrifices made by all veterans no matter what war is outstanding and commendable. And if they make money in the process, they earned it as far as I'm concerned.

I lost two uncles both in January 1945 not far from each others location. I'll be grateful to take what is offered from such folks as Spielberg and fill in my own blanks.

If not to make an effort at awareness of the many by the exploits of a few, the other alternative is to do nothing at all .... and that would be nothing short of tragic.

[StangStung]

The reason why the unit in Band of Brothers was covered because it was unique - they were there from D-Day until the end.

Wow, as long as that?
How about all the other units who were there as early as the 1st battles with the Germans, in some cases over two years before that?
Maybe some folks never heard of these obscure units. Outfits maybe no TV fan ever heard of, like, say, the 1st Infantry Division, or the 82nd Airborne?

I think you entirely missed my point. Every unit has a story that can be told and many of those stories may be compelling to different groups of people. And how is telling the 101st's story any different (more or less) compelling than the 1st or the 82nd story? I don't think it is.

Spielberg/Hanks wanted to tell the story of the war in Western Europe from an American perspective (not the war in Africa, or Italy, or the Pacific). They had a ready made story right in front of them - Band of Brothers, about the 502nd - that covered the time period of the US putting boots on the ground in France until the end.

Besides - I referenced the movie the Big Red One - that's a story that bears repeated retelling, but it has after all, been told.

Last edited by StangStung on Wed May 01, 2013 1:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[StangStung]

IMHO coverage of any group from any theater from anytime is a great thing for recognition to ALL groups from any theater from anytime. To honor one veteran is to honor ALL veterans. I for one am very thankful for the folks who put in the time and $$$$$ to create these series, movies, documentaries etc. They may not come out all rosy at times but the effort to bring awareness to the sacrifices made by all veterans no matter what war is outstanding and commendable. And if they make money in the process, they earned it as far as I'm concerned.

I lost two uncles both in January 1945 not far from each others location. I'll be grateful to take what is offered from such folks as Spielberg and fill in my own blanks.

If not to make an effort at awareness of the many by the exploits of a few, the other alternative is to do nothing at all .... and that would be nothing short of tragic.

Well said. And I think this is the perspective that Spielberg and Hanks are coming from. Can you name any other Hollywood types who have worked as hard to bring recognition to the veterans of WWII? Think about it - Saving Private Ryan, Band of Brothers, The Pacific, this new 8th project - not to mention all of Spielberg's other WWII movies.

While you may pick knits on their projects - a favorite pass time of our hobby it seems - you cannot deny that they've brought a tremendous amount of attention to veterans, and especially WWII veterans.

[p51]

you cannot deny that they've brought a tremendous amount of attention to veterans, and especially WWII veterans.

True, but the veterans themselves even wonder why only the 'specialized' troops get the honor? I have heard vets ask me why movies and TV series like this can't be about the simple line grunt?
SPR: Rangers and Airborne
BoB: Airborne
Pacific: USMC
All of these segments were the minority in their respective theaters of operation (and in the case of the TV series, each knocked the grunts who were in the majority and did most of the fighting in WW2). It's not a case of, "I want to see only a specific shoulder patch," it's a desire from vets of WW2 who I have heard get upset at the idea that WW2 was won by AB, Rangers and Marines. Never mind anyone else. There are as many (if not more) amazing stories out there for line units as there were for the examples above.
It's bad enough that re-enacting has become a contest as to how many people can represent the exceptions and not the rule, it's such a shame that movies have to be the same.

[StangStung]

you cannot deny that they've brought a tremendous amount of attention to veterans, and especially WWII veterans.

True, but the veterans themselves even wonder why only the 'specialized' troops get the honor? I have heard vets ask me why movies and TV series like this can't be about the simple line grunt?
SPR: Rangers and Airborne
BoB: Airborne
Pacific: USMC
All of these segments were the minority in their respective theaters of operation (and in the case of the TV series, each knocked the grunts who were in the majority and did most of the fighting in WW2). It's not a case of, "I want to see only a specific shoulder patch," it's a desire from vets of WW2 who I have heard get upset at the idea that WW2 was won by AB, Rangers and Marines. Never mind anyone else. There are as many (if not more) amazing stories out there for line units as there were for the examples above.
It's bad enough that re-enacting has become a contest as to how many people can represent the exceptions and not the rule, it's such a shame that movies have to be the same.

I think those fellows in The Pacific are a pretty good depiction of the "front line grunt" as you say. Moreover, I didn't get any impression that any of these depictions were "a knock" against any other soldiers.

But if you're going down that trail, then why not make mini-series about the plane mechanics? Or the Red Ball Express drivers? Or a dozen other outfits that all contributed? Look, you can't please everyone - yourself included as shown. And pictures about "elite" units draw more viewers. It is ENTERTAINMENT after all, not an educational film, not a documentary.

As far as re-inacting --- you're surprised that people whose hobby is dressing up as soldier would rather pretend to be the general than the private? I'm not. And that's not a dis against re-inacting, that's just an observation of human nature. Who wants to be the lineman rather than the QB? Very few.