Warbird Information Exchange

Show them the wall of shame I'm a 26 yr vet, if you will count the first few years as an associate!!

OK Rob..... you were not kidding..... I've got two black eyes already......
Herr Obergrafeter, Welcome to the board! For Rob. For openers.....
#1. How about Coca Cola Corp...... They were a major sponsor for shows for the Dixie Wing.... That is where the ball really got rolling..... Then
#2. Fina. The major sponsor for the CAF Hq Airsho'. The contributions from Fina alone are well into the seven digit range.
#3. The Tuskegee Airman are a unique group of gentlemen. They know flying and what it takes to keep an airplane in the air..... These guys are a genuine class act.
#4. Jesse Jackson...... don't know him personally, did not know he cared about historic aircraft ..... but several groups out of Houston gave us a tremendous amount of grief.......Sheila Jackson Lee if I have the name right.... A Texas State Congresswoman from the 18th District. Very ugly to the press/TV media about the name "Confederate Air Force" concerning the Houston show..... The name of the show for Houston quietly (over time) morphed into "Wings Over Houston".
#5. The P-82, on this one, what I stated is what was told to me and approximately 300 other members/guests at the 06 Winter Conference by Bob Rice. Any beef here is between you and Bob.
#6. I know you have stated show me the voting totals.... Ok, does it really matter......The name is changed, it is not going back... so why keep beating a dead horse. Did I like the change? No.
#7. Ok, so not to sound like a parrot from Midland.... Did I like or do I like every decision made in Midland... certainly not. However, I found that sounding off to my airshow buds had no input..... So, I got off my butt, started attending the conference's, started meeting those WHO DO make policy. Have I directly influenced policy... Probably not.... but there are 2-3 general staff guys that have been gracious enough to listen to my thoughts or views and have noted my comments. There have been several items that I have heard out at various airshows and when I called and spoke with one of my general staff guys, what I was told (airshow) and what was from Hq, were two very different things..... These guys (general staff) are everyday guys. From a high school principal, to a Oklahoma Cop, plus a few business guys.... They all have the same goal....to keep'em flying..... same here..... Alan

Well said Alan. I didn't like the name change at first, but I understand the reasons behind it.

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Dan Johnson

Welcome all you newbees 27 years a Col.

Do we have any 30yr vets???

Sheila Jackson Lee is an embarassment to the Houston area. She never fails to make a racial connection and she never misses an opportunity to get in front of a camera.

Wings Over Houston has been the name of the Houston show since it began at Ellington. Before that the show was held at Galveston because there was no suitable airport available in Houston. Ellington was still a military field back then.

There was never any atempt to hide the WOH connection with Gulf Coast Wing and West Houston Squadron of the Confederate Air Force.

Rob, I think Fina was the big impetus. They were having a hard time with the Confedeate part. Money makes the world go round and they were with holding a bunch.

I personally gave no thought as to the political ramifications of the name "Confederate Air Force" when I became a member several years ago, until I received a letter from the INS (US Immigration and Naturalization Service) regarding my green card (permanant residency) application. It stated that my background check had been delayed, further investigation was required, and "would I forward details of my involvement with the militia wing of a southern states political organization of which I had indicated membership".

It took me quite a while to work out that they were talking about my Confederate Air Force membership.

Not everyone has knowledge of the warbird scene, and certainly the clerk at the INS did not know about the CAF, but that same clerk did manage to come up with an incorrect assumption about the organization based on his/her limited knowledge of the use of the word "Confederate". I believe that the same assumptions were made by many who had no knowledge about the CAF and unfortunately many of them were, or still are, the very same people who control the "purse strings" at some large corporations.

I joined the CAF to help preserve the memory of the men and woman who risked all for the defense of their country, and to honor them by "keeping them flying". To do this takes money. If changing the name avoids those "purse string" holders making the same assumption as the INS clerk, and increases the chances of retaining/obtaining Corporate sponsorship, then I'll go with the name change anytime.

Just my "tuppence worth", or should that be "2 cents worth"?

Julian

Julian, an interesting post. Yes it is interesting how some people see a word and automatically make a wide-sweeping assumption about the meaning and implications, without realising the true context.

When I first heard about the CAF back in the 1980's as a kid, through watching a fantastic BBC documentary called Colonel Culpepper's Flying Circus, I thought it was a brilliant group. Not coming from the USA I had no pre-programmed meaning for the word confederate so the stigma of the long-extinct country of the Confederate States of America and it's awful policies never tarnished my view of the name. I never even made the connection till I first heard the name had changed.

Confederate in real terms does not mean south of America, or those who want slaves or anything whatsoever to do with USA vs CSA politics.

Confederate is a word that simply means 'joined by treaty or agreement' (OED).

As there are many chapters of the CAF across the USA and the world, including here in NZ, all doing their own thing but under one big umbrella, this proper description of the word has merit too - a confederacy as a united group of warbird lovers joined together through signing up to the CAF.

However, because of that stigma attached to the word confederate thanks to the so-called civil war, many people today only see what they think they are seeing when they read the word.

They obviously don't understand that there is always more than one meaning to a word, but as others have said, sometimes they have influence in the money department. So, if the name had to be changed so as not to distort the intention of the CAF in the eyes of the less educated, fine by me. The CAF has been an amazing body for the preservation of aircraft, long may it continue under whatever name its leaders choose.

Sadly because of my childhood conditioning through watching that BBC video over and over, coupled with my knowing that confederate is a harmless word and the fact that I can never remember what the new name is, I still autoatically refer to it as the Confederate Air Force. Sorry.

As an aside, regardless of what the group's name is, I think the more worrying thing they should be looking at in regards to public perception is the recent spate of crashes, many fatal, which have sadly occurred. We all know these things happen for various reasons and it's often bad luck they happen so frequently in a short space of time, but many in the public won't view it so rationally, and nor will the press.

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I'm not a CAF member and maybe this is a case of jumping in where I don't belong, but as a non-member I am thankful for the CAF whatever their name is. They are about the only volunteer warbird organization that is still flying their aircraft regularly. Outside of the POF on the west coast, can you name one volunteer group that is still flying a substantial fighter fleet? Most other Museums have grounded or sold off the fighters to raise cash. CWH has sold most of the fighters I've grown up with, the Air Zoo and EAA are grounded, the less said about what happened to the NWM the better. But here all these years later and the CAF is still flying warbirds...

Jim

Ok OK, Let's all play nice. I've been with the Az Wing for only 17 years so I guess I'm still a newbie. I don't really care what the name is. The organization has provided me with opportunities I would never have gotten elsewhere. I've been an A&P mech for several years and and have had the priveledge (honor) to work on and fly in several historic aircraft and to be a part of something greater than just me. Like any volunteer group, it can be a volitale mix. I've stomped off several times in the past but always returned because I still believe we can make a difference in educating todays youth regarding the high cost of freedom and the roles their grandparents and great grandparents played in securing our freedom during the most tenuous of times. I don't care what organization one belongs to, whether it is the Yankee Air Force, Collings, Chino Air Museum, or the CAF. We are all in this thing together and need to support one another. I get a kick out of going to other museums and seeing people take pride in their efforts regardless of the size of their museum. Every person or organization who is truly dedicated to the preservation and presentation of history should pat themselves on the back because it's getting harder and more costly every day. Hats off to every organization and individual out there regardless of what you may call yourself.

When starting this this thread I in NO way intended to (re)start this old flame war.
I only meant to exchange information....

Let's let sleeping dogs lie.
If the old name means that much to you buy or trade for the CASA and start a new group of Confederates. [/b]

It is amazing that one has to go to New Zealand to find one of the few that understands the meaning of the "C" word.
How can we teach history to people that do not even understand the founding of our country. Anybody remember the Articles of Confederation, long before the problem between the North and South.
For the non members the reason I brought this up is that we have been told by Midland to erase the C word from all that we do. Throw away our old uniforms and patches. Not good enough to just officially change our name.
What no one told us is how do you get the general public to erase it from their memory. Burn all the books, movies etc.?

"Forget?, H*LL!"

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DBF

In the context of the "C" word, it brings another PC question: Should WW2 axis aircraft be restored/repainted with the Swastika?
Thx,
VL

Yes, I knew it was time for the "paint" subject to come back up.

Just joking! Ok, so maybe I'm not.

Tim

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