F-16's to Iran?

RickH · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 3:37 pm

How'd they do against the F-22, Chris?

global111 · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 3:39 pm

RickH wrote:

How'd they do against the F-22, Chris?

Pass.......
MOD not sent any to Red Flag or vice versa yet :wink:

But if the F-22's perform better than the -15E's then it would be quite interesting.....

Randy Haskin · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 4:27 pm

global111 wrote:

Though the RAF Typhoons the USAFE (F-15C/D/E and F-16C/D) have gone up against have beaten them in all but 1 excercise over the past 3 months or so......

This is a highly subjective claim.

FWIW, fighters never get together and fly "blue on blue" just to see who comes out on top.

There is ALWAYS a training objective, and someone is ALWAYS the unlimited good-guy and someone is ALWAYS the limited bad guy. The bandit may be limited in weapons, performance, tactics, whatever...but he's not fighting full up.

While I don't doubt that the Typhoon is a capable aircraft, I highly doubt the way that reports say it kicked the F-16s and F-15s halfway to China and back. Probably similar to the "Cope India" hype from a couple years ago that turned out to be false.

PS -- I'll be at RAF Lakenheath this fall/winter

tom d. friedman · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 7:57 pm

well.... let's turn up the heat another notch...... venezuela's military says it may sell it's f-16's to china or iran because they don't like president dubya!! fine!!! that's ok, hate the guy, but we are still long time allies with venezuela, & long time friends don't " F " each other over by selling to countries with wacko leaders who have no grasp of reality. ole dubya may be a little overwhelmed mentally right now but he's not crazy. maybe in the future we should add the stipulation to our military sales contracts that countries buying our hardware & technology can't re-sell it to ever they friggin please too.

RickH · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 9:19 pm

Tom, those F-16s were sold to Chile long before Dubya was President. I remember when we talked to Texstars in Dallas about birdproof side panels for the F-4 in 1999, that a Chilean Colonel(?) had a bird strike and shortly after that happened they bought new F-16 canopies from Texstars. I believe that happened in 1998.

I think there are provisions against selling our technology to an unfriendly power. Problem is, that Venezuela wasn't unfriendly until Chavez took power.

TimAPNY · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 9:28 pm

Did not Japan want to sell the Russian (USSR) info on how to run Sub's silent back in the 80's. Far too many poeple in this world have a price.

Tim

Forsight is something this country seems to have little of at times. Or we're just caught with our pants down time to time. :wink:

chico · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 9:37 pm

Venezuala isn't really unfriendly now. They're just ruled by a semi-savvy whack job.

This is just me spouting off at the mouth; A few years ago, India and Pakistan got all huffy with each other and threatened to go to war and bust out the firecrackers that they call nukes. Low and behold the world went batty. The "civilized" world fell all over itself trying to provide the "help" those two nations needed to work out their differences. I'm sure the "help" involved all kinds of debt relief, aid packages, sweetheart trade deals, etc. Once the nations had some nice fat deals on the table, the threat of war went away.....

Now, I'm not saying it was a concious effort on either parties part, I'm just saying that when you've got a screaming child, shutting the kid up becomes priority number one.

Which brings us back to Venezuala. Hugo says he wants to sell F-16's to Iran, China, Auric Goldfinger, the boogyman, etc. We know full well that 1. The birds he's got would just about make the grade as desert storage fodder here in the U.S. 2. They can't have much in the way of usable spares or modern electronics, so if he sells 50, that's means about a dozen flyables, and 3. the sale of these aircraft to an unfriendly nation will royally cheese off the United States in an "official" manner. Like "for once we can even complain to the UN and they'll listen and agree" manner. Chavez probably knows this. But he'll keep on making noise until somebody listens to him.

Bottom line; Rattling a sabre makes noise. Drawing one does not. There's not much about this deal that has anything to do with the sale of F-16's.

tom d. friedman · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 9:43 pm

rick, yeah, i know there are provisions about selling our toys to rogue nations, but we should re-do the small print on the contracts to prevent current friends who might later get pissed off at us from selling to our potential enemies. liken it to divorce!! :axe:

RickH · **Posted:** Wed May 17, 2006 10:20 pm

Tom, you don't know about the little packages built into every jet we sell to a foreign country ?

Its just like when you pay off a car early,...someone at the factory pushes a button and the darn thing starts to fall apart ! :lol:

I think that Lockheed bought the technology from Ford or GM.

Broken-Wrench · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:37 pm **Posts:** 1197

global111 wrote:

mrhenniger wrote:

Randy Haskin wrote:

Looking forward to shooting down a couple Vipers, should the opportunity arise.

The US forces clearly dominate when it comes to superiority, or likely better states, air supression.

Though the RAF Typhoons the USAFE (F-15C/D/E and F-16C/D) have gone up against have beaten them in all but 1 excercise over the past 3 months or so......

Flypast B.S. gossip........................................ :roll:

global111 · **Posted:** Thu May 18, 2006 4:30 pm

Broken-Wrench wrote:

Flypast B.S. gossip........................................ :roll:

Thats what the Typhoon pilot said Air-to-Air, and at the same time the F-15's were rather quiet :wink:

Broken-Wrench · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:37 pm **Posts:** 1197

Dude take that trash talk over to fly fast. The tyhpoon was designed during the 70's in the UK while we were designing the F-15, F-16. If anything they let you guys win so the national pride wouldn't be hurt. Typhoon, yesterdays fighter built for today. On second thought it belongs on this board as a hopped up relic.

wls3 · **Posted:** Thu May 18, 2006 10:21 pm

Quote:

Did not Japan want to sell the Russian (USSR) info on how to run
Sub's silent back in the 80's. Far too many poeple in this world have a price.

While the country of Japan didn't sell info on how to run quieter
subs, I believe the Japanese company Toshiba did sell milling machines
to the Russians who used them with somebody elses software to make
quieter sub propellers.

Bill

Paul Krumrei · **Joined:** Sun Apr 03, 2005 11:06 pm **Posts:** 1757

global111 wrote:

RickH wrote:

How'd they do against the F-22, Chris?

Pass.......
MOD not sent any to Red Flag or vice versa yet :wink:

But if the F-22's perform better than the -15E's then it would be quite interesting.....

The -15E's are 2 seater bomber versions are they not? Or are you thinking of the -15C models from the FF ( Langley )

I can remember the F-15E's running only at night during Desert Storm deployed from Seymore Johnson the famous SJ's

Randy Haskin · **Posted:** Fri May 19, 2006 7:11 am

Paul Krumrei wrote:

The -15E's are 2 seater bomber versions are they not? Or are you thinking of the -15C models from the FF ( Langley )

I can remember the F-15E's running only at night during Desert Storm deployed from Seymore Johnson the famous SJ's

I wouldn't go so far so as to call the Strike Eagle a "bomber" -- it is certainly a fully multi-role fighter, though. Interestingly, the F-15A/B were also technically multi-role, having the capability to drop bombs, too, but when it came on line the F-4 was the primary multirole fighter. Over the years, the F-15A/B/C/D community morphed itself into this air-to-air only capability that has -- in recent engagements -- made itself obsolete.

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F-16's to Iran?

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