Brewster Buffalo

[RMAllnutt]

Not sure about the Buffalo at MAPS in Ohio - presumably either a repro or a few parts - bu there is an attractive reproduction at the Cradle of Aviation Museum http://www.williammaloney.com/Aviation/CradleOfAviationMuseum/BrewsterF2A2Buffalo/index.htm.

The MAPS buffalo was a hoax from everything I heard, as was the whole bequest. Nothing ever came of it sadly. Rather an unfortunate joke made at MAPS expense. I never did hear what the end result was, but no aircraft ever materialized as far as I know. Anyone hear differently?

Richard

[AirJimL2]

The MAPS buffalo was a hoax from everything I heard, as was the whole bequest. Nothing ever came of it sadly. Rather an unfortunate joke made at MAPS expense.

Richard

Richard is correct it was a hoax. However, I don't feel bad for MAPS as they were advised to verify the story and view the "aircraft" before they made it public. Oddly a few days later I'm reading about the donation in the Cleveland Plain Dealer...talk about mismanagement...

Jim

[airnutz]

You know, people always conveniently forget thast usually, in such an aircraft sale, there is a PURCHASER who also agrees to pay that price.

I've wondered a few times, how long would BW-372 have languished in storage had the NMNA not tapped into
their(our) deep pockets to pay/trade something anywhere near the $3 million asking price? I was especially miffed
at the time about the seeming hypocrisy of NHC's draconianesque reclamation program, but at the same time
no qualms about NMNA's participation in the shadier aspects of BW-372's recovery.

If there were no such thing as a purchaser, these filthy speculators would be gone. See, all we need to do is petition our new CIC here in the US to regulate all aircraft recoveries in the world and designate the USN as the agency in charge of recovery. The prices could then be fixed in congressional debate, maybe attached to an earmark in an appropriations bill, and those evil speculators will be out of business. Of course, there would have to be a bill to offset the losses of all the speculators (people like me) and subsidize us while training us to do new jobs. Personally, I would rather do shrubbery and gardening instead of grubbing warbird parts. But, hey, we all have our own personal he((s, don't we! It's such a tragic thing to see all those years of perspiration looking for something turn out to only be cash... and flying aircraft or rare preserved planes. So... what do I want to say?... I guess words don't quite express it...

Signed,
Future Shrubber and Gardener, if you pay for it...

What's amatta U Bunky, bailout blues gettin' to ya'?

[H.Finn]

Would love to keep the Brewster (we never called the Buffaloes, I guess that is RAF's name for them) here in Finland, but better to have it on loan for a while than nothing. The arrangement has made it possible for at least one old Brewster pilot, Sgt Dahl, to see again the airplane in which he made his second flight on the type in 1940. For this alone, I think it was worth getting the airplane to Finland for three years. Sadly, Sgt Dahl passed away a few months after reuniting with his old mount, at the age of 90, if I recall correctly.

One small correction: Marja Lampi, who was involved in the recovery of the Brewster from Russia and wrote a book about the story, including how she and others were swindled, is not daughter of BW-372's pilot on its last flight, Lauri Pekuri, but a daughter of another Brewster-ace, Heimo Lampi.

We did have a number of Brewster-aces here...

[Second Air Force]

We did have a number of Brewster-aces here...

And that alone is enough reason for me to wish BW-372 could stay in Finland.

Thanks for the story of Sgt. Dahl and his reunion with the Brewster.
Scott

[old iron]

H Finn wrote:

Marja Lampi, who was involved in the recovery of the Brewster from Russia and wrote a book about the story, including how she and others were swindled,

For those of us who do not have access to the book, could you give us the "boiled down" version of what happened to the Brewster after its recovery? I remember that there was uncertainty about who the owners were, and if memory serves, some Russian oligarchs got involved. I think that those who recovered the aircraft were not able to keep it. Could you fill us in on the particulars?

[Mike]

Weren't there some subtantial remains of one or more ex-Netherlands East Indies (?) examples in circulation a few years back? At one point, the RAF Museum were claiming that they had obtained them, but the deal apparently fell through.

[old iron]

According to Dan Ford (http://www.warbirdforum.com/dutchbuf.htm) these reputed three Brewsters were just bits and pieces including a few cockpit instruments. A few of these pieces may have been incorporated into a reproduction, which is illustrated in the Dan Ford web page (this is I believe not the Cradle of Aviation reproduction, but a separate one, in Dutch markings). The cockpit instruments are included in another Dutch display.

[airnutz]

Weren't there some subtantial remains of one or more ex-Netherlands East Indies (?) examples in circulation a few years back? At one point, the RAF Museum were claiming that they had obtained them, but the deal apparently fell through.

Mike, I just spent the morning reaquainting myself with Mr. Ford's Buffalo pages, I haven't been in there in years.

You may be referring to the so-called "California Buffalo" bits recovered by Vintage Aircraft Company, Sonoma Calif.
and then part or parts on to Militaire Luchtvaart Museum. Info here..
www.warbirdforum.com/dutchbuf.htm

I went down the entire production list of Buffalo's and wandered around the site looking for the story of the Buff
which was found at a plantation in the early 1960's which had survived after a belly landing in WW2. Can't find it. Do you remember the story? Sickening ending for a potential fairey tale!

[John Dupre]

According to Dan Ford (http://www.warbirdforum.com/dutchbuf.htm) these reputed three Brewsters were just bits and pieces including a few cockpit instruments. A few of these pieces may have been incorporated into a reproduction, which is illustrated in the Dan Ford web page (this is I believe not the Cradle of Aviation reproduction, but a separate one, in Dutch markings). The cockpit instruments are included in another Dutch display.

It is a separate replica from the Cradle of Aviation example but it was built by them for the Dutch.

[airnutz]

One small correction: Marja Lampi, who was involved in the recovery of the Brewster from Russia and wrote a book about the story, including how she and others were swindled, is not daughter of BW-372's pilot on its last flight, Lauri Pekuri, but a daughter of another Brewster-ace, Heimo Lampi.

Hello H.Finn, good to have you here again on the WIX. Thank you for the correction! The memory is rusty. I also couldn't remember the name of the original backer, Marvin Kottman, the other night, either.

Last edited by airnutz on Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[DaveM2]

One small correction: Marja Lampi, who was involved in the recovery of the Brewster from Russia and wrote a book about the story, including how she and others were swindled, is not daughter of BW-372's pilot on its last flight, Lauri Pekuri, but a daughter of another Brewster-ace, Heimo Lampi.

We did have a number of Brewster-aces here...

Yes, need to slap myself with a wet fish..off to do so now

[airnutz]

Again Nathan, it was/is the last easily attainable Buffalo. There are none known other than in the ocean.

Isn't there a persistent rumor of a Marine F2A in a swamp somewhere?

I don't recall hearing of that one John. Are you sure it's not the Brewster F3A recovered from a NC swamp by Lex Cralley?

[airnutz]

I've wondered a few times, how long would BW-372 have languished in storage had the NMNA not tapped into
their(our) deep pockets to pay/trade something anywhere near the $3 million asking price?

OOOPs! Tho early in the game when the Brewster was still in Karelia and the new Russian "partners" found out 372
was"The Last Buffalo" the price of $10 million was mentioned at one point. Later when things settled down the price
was $1 million. I dunno why I wrote down $3m previously, it's concievable starting at 10 and sliding down to 1, 3 was possible at one point.

BTW, How many dollars would a stripped down P-3 Orion airworthy or near-airworthy fetch?