From a C-47 crash site. Someone can help us?

[K5DH]

Bon giorno Pierpafree e Salerno1943!

in Italy we can offer hospitality, good food and wine and great friendship for sure!

I can vouch for that! I've been to many places in Italy, I found this to be true everywhere.

Best of luck to you, gentlemen! You are doing a most honorable thing.

Ciao,
Dino

---
Dean K5DH

[pierpafree]

and of course you will be well accepted into our little group of ww2 fanatics!
Next time in Italy you have to reach us in the South!

[Pathfinder]

Do you think you could post the important parts of the "history" you found in the book?

What happened to the casualties?
Were they recovered by the locals?
Were they recovered by the military?
US? British?
Where were they buried if local?
When were they recovered?
After the crash? After the war?

[salerno1943]

Do you think you could post the important parts of the "history" you found in the book?

Thanks Pathfinder. The book spoke about war year in our zone. This book have just a small section of 4 pages about over 20 aircraft accident in our zone. About this crash author wrote just some words.

What happened to the casualties? He not wrote. He just wrote they received a funeral from italian authorities.

Were they recovered by the locals? From local people. First the shepperds that were on the mountain.

Were they recovered by the military?
US? British?

Where were they buried if local? Not wrote. I believe they were buried at Nettuno War Cemetery because all USA casualties of south Italy are in this cemetery.

When were they recovered?
After the crash? After the war?

The author wrote that dead and wounded were recovered after the crash. 2 or 3 wounded deceased after they were recovered.

[salerno1943]

Friend of another forum identify another tool of photo 7: a military type cotter key/pin puller

[Pathfinder]

Nettuno War Cemetery...right....officially this is the SICILY-ROME American Cemetery and Memorial operated by ABMC.

There are also two British War Cemeteries relatively close by.

[Pathfinder]

BTW--regarding the "fork" handle. It is entirely possible that this is the handle of a fork...exactly the same as a spoon...and later model mess kit knives had the same handle.

I have interviewed a lot of WW2 paratroopers, and nearly to a man they said that carried the mess kit SPOON for general eating purposes. They carried plenty of knives as a matter of equipment...but they found the spoon most practical. Why? One man told me: You can't eat soup with a fork....

[ZRX61]

Friend of another forum identify another tool of photo 7: a military type cotter key/pin puller

Harbor Freight sell those, about 49c each. I have one, they're made of cheese.

[patelie]

Matteo... and All

I just got today my microfilm reader at home (ouff, i was searching one since a long time) and I am able to help you, giving the unit of the negro soldiers and the names of the crew.

The first part is from the group diary and the second one from the squadron diary, which is more interesting.

GROUP DIARY - AUGUST 1944
Group Engineering
August 1: Aircraft N°43-15153 crashed in mountains of southern Italy near Montevergine Monastery. Nine passengers were killed.

Historical events
July 31 - A plane from the 79th T.C. Sq. crashed near Foggia at 1000 killing nine of the eighteen colored passengers. The crew and other passengers escaped with minor injuries. a plane from the 82nd T.C. Sq. flying in the same formation hit some trees, but pulled up and made a safe landing at a nearby airport. The plane was damaged, but no one was injured.

Historical narrative
July 31 was an unlucky day for the Group as one plane of the 79th T.C. Squadron crashed near Foggia killing nine of the eighteen negro passengers. The crew escaped with minor injuries.


SQUADRON DIARY - AuGUST 1944

SECTION THREE : Narrative
On the previous day, July 31, the squadron's first crack up in Italy occured when five ships were ferrying Negro soldiers to Foggia. Flying under a heavy cloud bank, one plane collided with a mountain. All of the crew-- pilot Lt. Howard B. Wank, co-pilot Lt. Marvin (NMI) Butz, crew chief Sgt. Raymond H. Kelley, radio operator S/Sgt. Charles T. Taylor-- escaped injury, but nine of the 16 passengers were killed.The plane was washed out, necessitating replacement by one of the plane left in England.

SECTION FIVE : Operations report
The missions first crack-up occured two days later, on the 31st. Five ships took off at 0800 to ferry Negro personnel of the 904th Security Battalion to Foggia. The formation was flying beneath a heavy cloud bank when a mountain suddenly appeared ahead, all the planes cleared the embankment but one--that flown by Lt. Howard B. Wank, whose ship crashed into the top of the mount, killing nine of the sixteen passengers. Wank and his crew -- co-pilot Lt. Marvin (NMI) Butz, crew chief S/Sgt. Raymond H. Kelley, radio operator S/Sgt. Charles T. Taylor-- escaped injury. The plane was washed out.

PS : It seems that the 904th Base Security Battalion provided security for Rosignano airfiled and ground station.
re-PS : The crew was the same one than on D-day

Hope this help

[Pathfinder]

Patrick Mon Ami!

FANTASTIC information as is usual!!!!

This has the makings of a very interesting story---and there are still no threads to pick up who the casualties were. No overseas burials listed for 904th....hmmmmm

904th Air Base Security Battalion, 1942-1945

904th Bn CO: LT COL S.A. Gordon, Jr., of Marion, AL,

904th was the first unit of its kind in the U.S. activated for WWII at Camp Rucker, AL, June 10, 1942;

Campaigns: North Africa, Sicily, Italy, and Southern France

904th deactivated in Italy, June 23, 1945;

[Nathan]

I find this thread very interesting.

Negro soldiers

Could this have caused some kind of cover up and since at the time negro's were still considered inferior that maybe the lack of names might be a cause?


Just a theory!

FWIW...I think the narrowing down of what race was on board might help out. No racism here...just looking at the facts.

Last edited by Nathan on Thu Jul 14, 2011 2:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Nathan]

Hey! This C-47 was with the 79th! But crash in 1997! While I am curious about the crew I am more curious what markings the plane wore. I may need to contact Dana Bell.

http://1000aircraftphotos.com/Contribut ... y/9462.htm

[Nathan]

Membury from wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Membury Along with a good C-47 shot.

Operation Dragoon:

For the invasion of southern France, a detachment from each squadron (the 79th, 80th, 81st and 82nd TCSs) was dispatched to Votone Air Base in Italy on July 19 and 20. Although the actual invasion mission, "Operation Dragoon" was not launched until 15 August. The detachments returned to Membury on August 23–24, by which time the 6th Tactical Air Depot units had moved to France.

[Pathfinder]

Hey! This C-47 was with the 79th! But crash in 1997! While I am curious about the crew I am more curious what markings the plane wore. I may need to contact Dana Bell.

http://1000aircraftphotos.com/Contribut ... y/9462.htm

79th TCS carried S6 as a nose code.....

Let's not get our C-47 threads mixed up!

[Pathfinder]

Note the discrepancy in numbers.
The Group diary references "nine of eighteen" casualties.
The Squadron diary references "nine of sixteen".