The failure to properly train new A&P's

kenlyco · **Joined:** Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:05 pm **Posts:** 656

Nada!!

krlang · **Posted:** Thu Dec 18, 2008 7:13 pm

Wow,
Alot to say, but not alot of time to type it. I'm too hungry.

Spent the last two days running around New England to replace a switch in a Citation. 600 miles later I got it done. Not a bad day, 10 hours of travel time and 2.5 of work.
One trip to t-shoot, return with the part, and crappy traffic on the way home.

We are busy again, but for how long?

RandolphB · **Posted:** Thu Dec 18, 2008 10:01 pm

bdk wrote:

[If you have some free time on a Saturday, drop by my hangar at Chino!

I certainly will! I'll pm once I am back from visiting Kermit Week's collection of...er, I mean, my dad in Florida!

RB

bdk · **Joined:** Sun May 02, 2004 1:16 am **Posts:** 11336

I look forward to it! Maybe when they have the P-40 event the first Saturday in January? I'll probably be out a lot over the holiday break as well.

A2C · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:08 am

My feeling is this:

Bring 'em on. If the mechanics are trained poorly, then get them a job and show them how the work is really done. If they don't cut it, tell them to do something else.

JDK · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 5:12 am

RandolphB wrote:

Howdy,

This is my first post here, but I've been following the boards for some years now. The A & P thread is close to home and I finally have something to say...

Well there's no prize for best first post (and there shouldn't be) but that's a great one. Welcome to the forum, and I look forward to your further posts!

skymstr02 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 6:08 am

A2C wrote:

My feeling is this:

Bring 'em on. If the mechanics are trained poorly, then get them a job and show them how the work is really done. If they don't cut it, tell them to do something else.

As an employer, I can't afford to pay them to learn. If I cannot bill their hours, then it comes out of my pocket. Face it, its the bottom line that counts.
If I do train them, looking to the future to recoup the losses, they leave for another job that pays .35/hr more.
I have a 180 day probationary period, where their work ethic is evaluated periodically, and if they don't cut it, I cut them.
I too attended a well known technician school in Inglewood back in the early 70's, and the last phases on repair stations set the pace for the proper work ethic, not how to pass the written tests. Out of a basic class of 46, 6 ended up graduating and getting certificates.

JDK · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 6:21 am

One of the themes coming up is the issue of a problem with hard work among some/many 'young people today'. (While I'd agree at times, I'm sure most of us would admit the same was said by our elders and our school classes could've had it levelled at us in the mass, then too...) An interesting article about how most achievement, even 'genius' has to be founded on hard work.

http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/stories/s2427604.htm

So the good news it you could become a genius - you just need to work at it. I guess that's the bad news, too...

Broken-Wrench · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:37 pm **Posts:** 1197

[quote="A2C"]My feeling is this:

Bring 'em on. If the mechanics are trained poorly, then get them a job and show them how the work is really done. If they don't cut it, tell them to do something else.[/quote]

That's what I did at the post office.. I did station audits / Quality assurance and was the breaker of dreams... I would show up unannounced on another airline and see if the mechanic would meet the plane and service the A/C.. I also did honesty tests when I had problems with a A/C and needed the mechanic to trouble shoot I would put torqe seal in a screw head bolt or whatever ( Not telling the oubound mechanic) and when the plane came back I would look for the seal to be broken so I would know if the mechanic atempted to solve the problem.... If Not I usally was at his station in a few days to can them.. Or if they had alot of problems getting with the program I canned them. I would then work their station untill I found a new mechanic. You didn't get to many warnings. Our contract required us to run at 90% and we could not afford some clowns to put all of our jobs in jeporady.

kenlyco · **Joined:** Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:05 pm **Posts:** 656

Ok this will give it away..

N3Njeff · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:58 am

Its either delta or Eastern

kenlyco · **Joined:** Sat Dec 08, 2007 11:05 pm **Posts:** 656

COME ON DELTA ....BINGO EASTERN!!!

A2C · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:53 pm

Quote:

... I would show up unannounced on another airline and see if the mechanic would meet the plane and service the A/C.. I also did honesty tests when I had problems with a A/C and needed the mechanic to trouble shoot I would put torqe seal in a screw head bolt or whatever ( Not telling the oubound mechanic) and when the plane came back I would look for the seal to be broken so I would know if the mechanic atempted to solve the problem.... If Not I usally was at his station in a few days to can them.. Or if they had alot of problems getting with the program I canned them. I would then work their station untill I found a new mechanic. You didn't get to many warnings. Our contract required us to run at 90% and we could not afford some clowns to put all of our jobs in jeporady.

Good point. The big thing is honesty, integrity, and competence. I know one or two who have been canned for failing on competence of a compression test, and weak work ethic, poor honesty, etc.

They could be darn smart, but the basics are gone..

Also the schools could improve for sure, in my opinion.

Bill Walker · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 12:58 pm

skymstr02 wrote:

I too attended a well known technician school in Inglewood back in the early 70's, and the last phases on repair stations set the pace for the proper work ethic, not how to pass the written tests. Out of a basic class of 46, 6 ended up graduating and getting certificates.

Was that Northrop by any chance? I was there, 1970 to 1974, getting a BAESc. Remember the paper riots at McKinley Hall?

A very interesting thread. I can only add that much of what was said about mechanics is also true of "real" engineers. A degree just shows that you can pass college exams. Then you have to go out and learn how to really do the job. Or learn that you were not meant to be an engineer, and move on.

The Inspector · **Posted:** Fri Dec 19, 2008 2:27 pm

L/N # 9? Really frightening!!!!!

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The failure to properly train new A&P's

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