Collings Foundation B-17G 909 Has Crashed :-( 10/2/2019

[JohnB]

Very tragic. FAA may halt the ride program after this...

Why?

Really, you have to ask?
Simply, bureaucrats doing bureaucratic things.
The politicians will be breathing down someone's neck, so they'll make changes so it looks like they are doing something, whether or it is justified or not.

Enforcement and punishment (to justify all the recently hired inspectors if nothing else) will be the order of the day for awhile.
After all, it is the same organization that tried to ground Bob Hoover and is under scrutiny over the 737 MAX mess.

[forkedtail]

Though tragic, there may be been some videos made by spectators of the B-17 take-off and crash. These could be valuable to investigators.

I have personally attended many of these vintage aircraft ground / flight events; flown in one, and realize that revenue from them is essential to their continuation. However, if you look at records of lives lost in crashes of just P-51's with two-place cockpits, there has been almost one fatality per year of a passenger in that aircraft configuration. Pilots are aware of the risk, but a passenger is trusting that nothing bad will happen in the hands of what they assume is an extremely skilled person, no matter how many releases they sign in advance.

[Chris Brame]

3) The aircraft was attempting to land on Runway 6. Upon landing, the aircraft hit the ILS instrument stanchion.

Anyone know where the ILS stanchion is in relation to the runway?

[p51]

Though tragic, there may be been some videos made by spectators of the B-17 take-off and crash. These could be valuable to investigators.

Not to mention cameras at the airport itself.
I would bet every penny in my wallet that there is video from the field of this accident, or least parts of it (take off, landing, contact with the ILS tower or the de icing farm). And if it exists, it'll be in the media eventually.
I, for one, don't wish to see my favorite B-17s final moments.

[aerovin]

3) The aircraft was attempting to land on Runway 6. Upon landing, the aircraft hit the ILS instrument stanchion.

Anyone know where the ILS stanchion is in relation to the runway?

Presumably they mean the glideslope antenna mast, which is about 900 feet down the runway from the RWY 06 threshold on the left side.

Edit: more info is the airplane hit the localizer antenna for the opposite end ILS (RWY 24) that is installed at a location short of the RWY 6 threshold.

Last edited by aerovin on Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[dbrown]

So sad to see this happen

Chilling audio of first responders. Those people are heroes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPC58RjNBH8

At this press conference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hURR8TxI9B0

the knucklehead senator at 11:50 should scare us all. The more he opened his mouth the more you just know the others are thinking STFU. His definition of 'oversight' IMO will no doubt regulate the end of such flights.

BUFFIE

[hurricane_yank]

I know totally off topic but I always find it amazing the strength of the human spirit in moments like this...we all say we would run into a burning building but to hear and see people that do...they are truly heroes in every sense of the word.

[Bradburger]

Very tragic news.

My thoughts are with all those involved in this terrible accident.

[Edit]

I came across this WFSB3 News interview with David Prescott, an historic aircraft owner and pilot, who has worked with the Collings Foundation, and new the pilot who was flying '909' today.
https://youtu.be/_dbTd0V57zM

As you'd expect, a much more accurate and informative interview/discussion than I've seen so far.

Cheers

Paul

[Xray]

Ultra sad news, condolences.

People here griping about people speculating are probably more annoying than the speculators, there will always be speculation of events in topic specific forum, you guys don't like em then don't read em.

Some clear pics here from dailymail, mostly plumes but one shot shows the wreckage, tail section and outer left wing is all that is recognizable. Also reported by an eye witness that at least 1 prop was not turning.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ticut.html

[p51]

Looks like it piled up against the building even before the fire...

Attachments

5d951ba5aa91e.image.jpg (31.99 KiB) Viewed 1725 times

[Mick G]

Do we know what part of the field it went down? i.e. was he lined up on a runway, does it appear that it was a overrun or was it put down on the field?

[OD/NG]

Do we know what part of the field it went down? i.e. was he lined up on a runway, does it appear that it was a overrun or was it put down on the field?

According to the NTSB, he was approaching to land on Runway 06 at KBDL. During this landing phase it collided with some part of the ILS system on the ground and then veered off massively to the right (south). The excursion ultimately ran into the de-ice farm/storage area, which is about 1000' or so to the side of the approach end of 06. If you pull up the satellite view on google maps, it becomes easier to understand. So, in a nutshell, the accident happened near the approach end of Runway 06, but displaced about 1000' to the right side in the deice storage area on the ramp.

[BigGrey]

They were trying to land on runway 6. They may of landed short and hit ILS equipment and veered to the right of the threshold and hit the de-icing storage tanks and trucks to the right of the runway. That is what has been reported.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9314663 ... a=!3m1!1e3

[JohnB]

None of your political horsesh*t has to do with a tragic accident that most posters in this thread have the where-with-all and common sense to leave out, other than to show how much of a hypocrite some members can be about leaving wild speculation and politics out of the conversation. .... Sound familiar?

Staying classy I see, and so gracious with the name calling.
My comments weren't political, rather my comments are born of 30 years of experience as a government bureaucrat and member of the media.
Simply put, nature abhors a vacuum, in the same vein, regulators have to make regulations, needed or not.

I wasn't speculating on the crash, I know better than that and have too much respect for the victims of the mishap to do that. However in response to an earlier post, I made an educated guess on the regulatory aspects of the outcome. Sorry if it offended anyone.

Last edited by JohnB on Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[marine air]

The CAF sent out an email asking members to be considerate of the Collings Foundation, and the family members at this time. They asked that members refrain from speculation as this is only hurtful to those involved.
That being said, the ride programs have been a great success and very safe for several decades now. The Collings people are pros. We should wait for the NTSB report. Age of the airplane , or the number of people onboard had nothing to do with why things happened as they did once it got back to the runway.
The brand new B-737 Max has caused 340 fatalities in two accidents in the last year in factory new aircraft . So let’s quit making broad , inaccurate, and damaging guesses. The B-17 has been operating in the military, commercial, civilian and now as flying museums with a great safety record. We will know what happened soon.