Pilot/Aircrew Lounge

Scott Rose · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 3:13 pm

In response to some people being offended by the recent nose art postings I have created the Pilot/Aircrew Lounge section. This is a private section and you will have to request permission to be allowed to enter. By requesting permission you are agreeing to the folowing:

1. You are 18 years old or older
2. You accept that material found in this topic might be offensive to some and you are okay with that.

To request permission send me an e-mail containing your user name and I will alter your permission level as soon as I get a chance.

This new group is not to be used for gratuitous nudity but should be limited to warbird nose art. Also, questionable humor will be allowed there as well. If you have any questions please e-mail me.

I have also created a poll to get your views on this.

Scott Rose · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 4:07 pm

Make sure you vote. This question effects everyone one way or another.

Warhawk · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 5:07 pm

My personal view is that since these are being presented in an historical context and not in a lewd or lacivious way, that they belong in the hanger. Off color jokes could probably go into an off topic sub forum, but I really have not seen anything that was bad enough to warrant that.

I will restate what I said to you at Nashua Scott, that politics lead to trouble and should stay off the board as much as possible. I realize that in the context of warbird recovery and dealing with the government (ours and others) that politics will come up from time to time and is impossible to get away from, however I think that folks can control themselves somewhat if they will just follow the guidelines you've set out.

I have been watching some of the things that have been going on over the last couple weeks and have stayed silent till now because I have not wanted to fan the flames further.

Thats my rant and I'm stickin' to it. To get back to the original point, if anyone who is offended by nose art presented in an historical context really need to get over themselves. We are not a bunch of knuckle dragging morons looking these things going, "hey Bevis, look at the boobs on that plane. Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh".

God I feel better now. Keep you're chin up Scott and don't let folks get you down. You are doing a cracker jack job and I (I'll not speak for anyone other than myself) appreciate what you are doing.

Ollie · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 5:08 pm

Come on!

Leave the nose art where it is.

I do not like censorship, especially over something as trivial as something painted on a plane.

Jack Cook · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 5:27 pm

DID I MISS SOMETHING HERE? YOU'VE GOT TO BE KIDDING THAT SOMEONES OFFENDED BY NOSEART!!!
I REALLY CAN'T IMAGINE A SECURED AREA FOR POSTING RESTRICTED PHOTOS. THERE'S A COUPLE THAT I WOULDN'T POST BECAUSE THEY'RE A LITTLE MUCH BUT I HONESTLY FEEL THAT THEIR A PART OF OUR HISTORY AND ESPECIALLY WARBIRD HISTORY PAST AND PRESENT. CAN YOU IMAGINE GOING TO AN AIRSHOW AND HAVING TO VIEW CERTAIN WARBIRDS (YELLOW ROSE, THE DRAGON, STRAWBERRY BITCH, SUNDAY PUNCH. GLAMOROUS GEN, LICKETY SPLIT ECT) IN A CONTAINED AREA WITH CANVAS COVERED FENCING WERE YOU HAVE TO SHOW ID TO GET IN???

TimAPNY · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 5:48 pm

Maybe it is the "stressing" the nakedness that should be avoided. Yes naked women where put on the side of aircraft. Yes it is historical, but putting all the most naked nose art into one thread may be a bit too far.

Sorry Scott for my monetary lap of reason / judgment. I edited my post.

I also voted to keep everything open, we are adults and should be able to adjust our behavior so that younger adults / teens can freely enjoy this board. I so wish I had something like this growing up.

The brew board I am also on has a team of moderators that keep tabs on the board. If anyone of them feels something is out of line they remove the thread to the moderator’s board to discuss and they as a group decides if it should be locked, deleted or put on the board. Scott this maybe helpful to you, I can give you the info on the board to contact them if you would like. You just need to find six or so people you trust to keep on eye on things.

Because the last thing we all want is for you to get burned out babysitting!

T J Johansen · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:58 pm

This idiotic political correctness gotta stop somewhere. If you have a problem with history (and nose-art is a part of that) and need to sanitize it, then this forum really isn't for you!!!! I hope I don't sound like I'm trying to take your place as admin on this site Scott, but I have a feeling from reading some of your earlier posts on this forum that you don't like this PC s**t any more than me. So to those who complain, sorry. If these posts makes your skin cringe, hit the back button and look at something else. I wonder what will be the next if we bend to things like this. Will a teenager coming to any forum with a question in a few years time be told something like "after the battle of the Bulge, the combatants all got up, dusted off each others uniforms and had dinner together before going home in order to be in bed at a proper hour"... :roll:

Kinda like the western comedy with Tom Berenger from some years back. He only shot people in the hand, and drank milk in the bar... If you don't like what's on TV, surf to another channel or turn it off all together. Same with a forum, if you don't like something then hit back or go to another web site! (And there are plenty to choose from!)

T J (Bringing a flashlight and a Squadron Signal In Action book to bed tonight. Gotta check out some ancient porrnn) :roll:

Don Martin · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 7:07 pm

I have to agree. Keep the politics and religon out; keep the history and the fun in. I'm sorry if I offend any one with this point of view ,but in my experience the mixing of it all is a recipe for conflict. Leave your sixguns at the door!

I pass the soap box..........

tom d. friedman · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 7:46 pm

a brave post topic by the person who initiated it!! i salute you!! why not make it available to all registered members?? who is offended?? if you are then don't look!! it should not be regarded as porrnn, nudity, etc, it should be regarded as a wartime art form that kept the troops morale & spirit positive to the benefit of everybody involved. (pardon the pun!!) do we have to sanitize this aspect of ww 2 history for the satisfaction of the revisionist, prudish, bible thumping self righteous demagogues?? tv displays more sexual inuendo & content than ww 2 nose art!! if this becomes the standard then our future aviation historians (NAMELY OUR YOUTH!!!!) will be blithering idiots to make a solid statement. they are our future for this site & this aspect of military & aviation history. our youth are exposed to more skin at the book store, tv, internet, video etc, with much more harmful inuendo. kids today have been exposed to far worse far earlier than us baby boomers & are far from shocked at some tame ww 2 cheese cake on a riveted piece of aluminum!! don't sweat the small stuff!! regards, tom

Scott Rose · **Posted:** Sun Feb 13, 2005 11:56 pm

I created this poll to see what the response would be. Personally I didn't want to do this anyways and it seems my original instinct was right and the general opinion support it, so the pilots lounge goes bye bye.

So the normal rules apply regarding nudity. Nothing graphic or gratuitous and should have some historical referemce.

Jack Cook · **Posted:** Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:12 am

In the spirit of the occasion, here's one of my favorities. B-25J 75th BS 42nd BG 13th AF.

tom d. friedman · **Posted:** Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:15 am

scott, can't say i blame you for your decision... with all the politically correct stuff being crammed down the u.s. citizenry's throat you are avoiding a real potential powder keg!! look at howard stern for example. aside from him this is an aviation site, but rest assured if you went along with the nose art forum somebody would find a way to pee on everybodies bonfire. such is life today & free speech is a joke.

Tulio · **Joined:** Mon May 03, 2004 1:05 am **Posts:** 3236

Free speech is now a joke, because we have allowed every politically correct kook, to come and dictate what we can say, think or do.

This is not a web-site for children. It is a site for adults, who have gained enough knowledge and maturity to understand what goes on in real life.

Denying the publication of any image of historical value, because it represents nakedness, would see us again puting dresses on Greek statues because they are naked . . . come on, PULEEEZEEE!!

If we allow these people to dictate to us what to do with the small things, we will never be able to stand up to them on the larger and more important issues.

Scott, for whatever my personal opinion is worth, keep things the way they are; do not create a special section nor allow narrow minded persons to tell us how to behave. If they don't like it, they can go somewhere else. Majority rules, and majority here has indicated with their vote, that there is no need for that kind of section at WIX.

People need to learn the difference between racy and pornographic.

Tulio

Jeffrey · **Joined:** Sun Sep 05, 2004 9:35 pm **Posts:** 253

firstly, don't get me wrong, I know and understand and appreciate the meaning of nose art and believe it all should be available to everyone with enough adult sense to be able to handle the fact that yes those ladies were not wearing everything their wardrobes held.

having said that I have seen some that without an excessively long preamble and judicious application of parental guidance would certain have this site earmarked as unacceptable by almost all the censorship programmes.

I haven't voted because I can see sense in having an area set aside for such examples as those despite the fact it is historically accurate and important to portray accurately for exactly that reason. It gives us an area where ALL nose art can be displayed without fear or favour or worry about retribution from the PC police and makes it so that no-one can complain simply because they have to ask to get in there and as such are giving their approval to be exposed to such imagery.

if it were up to me I'd say let everyone see it and if they don't understand why it's there then ask some-one who knows the history. But we all know how some people get upset by even the names of the aircraft ( big nig as an example ) let alone the images put upon them and how they would not even bother asking for the explanation but would ban it out of hand.

another good part is that by keeping the more graphic of images away from where minors can misuse them it might prevent possible repercussions for you Scott should a parent decide to become legally involved about an image taken from here

Forgotten Field · **Posted:** Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:58 pm

When I give a talk or presentation, I am not always able to articulate everything I would like to say, for fear of offending the audience. If we are in the habit of offending people with religious, cultural, or personal ethical choices, then we are not being very accomodating and are alienating potential allies in our endeavors. I don't look at internet porrnnography in front of my two children, and I don't come here to look at internet pornography- there are better sites in case you haven't found them yet, so keep searching. There are reasons to post nose art here, for illustration of a point or for historical identification, and we should continue to do that, but we should be, in Scott's words, judicious in making our choices to display things which may offend others.

For one example, I met a young girl (15) at Mid Atlantic Air Museum, who was doing WWII re-enacting, and who obviously came from a strong religious background. While she was definitely interested in participating in the events, you could see that she was visibly disturbed when it came to open nudity and some of the coarse language being used by a few people talking near us. She was VERY intelligent and interested in the whole WWII weekend thing, but her experience was not optimal, because some people just can't shut down their sewer/sailor mouths around teenagers, and some people can't get by without putting some types of what I would call "soft" porrnnography on display (unrelated to the weekend). I don't think that is a lot to ask of participants in a public event.

I'm not advocating that we clothe all the nose art, change the name of the CAF (confederate air force in my mind), or put everything here on a 5th grade level (although argument could be made that it is already on that level). But I am advocating and strongly advising everybody who reads this board that they think about what they put on public display here (in regards to adult tone, not aircraft parts sales) when it comes to others.

And my vote was against the pilot lounge, in case anybody was wondering. I'm going to go raise my prices now...

Fair warning- if you ever come to Forgotten Field, be prepared for Back River Neck Pirate Dialogue- it's hideous and usually starts after the first bottle of "salvaged" tequila... And this has sometimes led to public nudity at the seaplane ramp (beach)...

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