Turretless B-25 Mitchells??

[Shay]

http://www.shorpy.com/files/images/1a35294u.jpg



Wear these "C" models sent to operational units without dorsal turrets or were they installed later?

Shay
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Semper Fortis

[Second Air Force]

Shay,

I know next to nothing about B-25 production, but do you suppose the turrets were slow in arriving from the contractor? Covering the turret openings would allow the test-hops to be done, and maybe a modification line installed the turret later.

Scott

[B-25 C]

Shay
I worked on cleaning the turret that is at the Southern Museum of Flight from 41-12634 B-25C. You had to get down on you knees facing rear and lean on a breast plate to look down in the sighting system. Turret turned while you stayed stationary. Not a popular turret so a lot were removed in the field to save on weight and help to stream line the ac. Sorry I was thinking of the lower turret as I could not open your image.

Last edited by B-25 C on Thu Dec 17, 2009 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Shay]

That was my first thought. Next was that these might be Training or utility aircraft.

Looking at that picture. Does it look like a hatch has been installed right above where it says "754", just forward of the dorsal turret patch?

Shay
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Semper Fortis

[TimAPNY]

It appears this B-25 that was sent to the USSR still has a turret.

http://svsm.org/gallery/monino/Monino_Part_2_368

Tim

[Ken]

Regarding the Russian photo - something just doesn't look right with that airplane - the framework of the glass nose and/or cockpit. And the upper turret glass is oddly shaped too. Either there's been some cosmetic work or it's a replica. Anyone else see what I'm seeing??

[Jerry O'Neill]

I believe it was an airframe that was missing many parts. The props and the greenhouse are fabrications. That may be why it looks funny. It is a B-25 though.
Jerry

[Warhawk]

Ok, I did a bit of googling and I came across this and other pictures on flickr http://www.flickr.com/photos/library_of ... 179070581/ . It was taken in October 1942 by an Alfred T. Palmer at North Americans Inglewood outdoor assembly line. As for the hatch. Just a w.a.g. but life raft anyone?

[gary1954]

In the B-25, the original "dorsal turret" was a single machine gun that was raised up and out from the empennage through an opening that was created once a window was retracted.


It appears that the large patch on the empennage covers the original location of the "aft gun"
Is it possible that this large patch is a skin that was applied to the original configuration as this section of the plane had not yet incorporated the structural change from the original drawings? The photo below shows the size of the "window".


Additionally, I am not familiar with any version of the B-25 that had a life raft compartment aft of the forward of the center section.
Further, is it possible, that in the first photo posted by Shay, what we are seeing in this photo is aircraft that are destined to move down the ramp to a location at Inglewood, where the turret assemblies will be added to the airframe for fly away? I am however, uncertain of this, as I have a factory photo of B models in production minus outer wing panels that show the aft turret installed in the assembly area.


Hmmmm….. the Nose on the Russian B-25 isn't like any nose on a B-25 that I have never ever never seen

All of this is just my opinion of course, thoughts, ideas??

All of the above photos are from my collection acquired from Earl Blount NAA/Rockwell

[gary1954]

I believe it was an airframe that was missing many parts. The props and the greenhouse are fabrications. That may be why it looks funny. It is a B-25 though.
Jerry

Any idea as to the serial number of the Russian Bomber?

[The Inspector]

I'm amazed someone else hasn't answered this...the 'hatch' aft of the turret position on the spine of the fuselage was a doubler installed when it was discovered that the muzzle blast from the turret being fired directly aft was causing the skin to flex and deform, exactly what was done to prevent the same thing from happening when pack guns were added on the sides of the forward fuselage.

[The Inspector]

...that also explains the sort of truncated doubler just ahead of the turret opening

[Shay]

Thanks Inspector. Actually the "hatch" I was referring is the reason for the truncation of the "Doubler" forward of the turret.

This "Hatch" is very visible in Gary1954's production line photo on the first couple Mitchells as a bare metal area. You can even see what appears to be a latch.

I have to wonder if in the first picture that Gary posted of the early interior is showing what appears to be the backside of that cavity.

If so, it might be as Warhawk suggests, a location for the a liferaft.

Shay
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Semper Fortis

[gary1954]

The interior shot is in the empennage of a B-25A

I do not recall any North American B-25 of any model, having a life raft hatch aft of the center section, and I've been looking at B-25s since 1975

[Shay]

I do not recall any North American B-25 of any model, having a life raft hatch aft of the center section, and I've been looking at B-25s since 1975

Then what could it be?


From B-25C's PB account

Shay
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Semper Fortis