Warbird Information Exchange

I am planning on building a model RR layout that takes place in 1943 in the rural south. One of the sidings I'm planning will be for either a Army infantry training center or maybe a training airfield. Either way, I got to wondering if damaged or incomplete aircraft ever got moved to some of the more rural airfields during the war by train.
Does anyone know of any photos of airplane components being moved by flat car to stateside bases? I know some of these fields during the war were out in the sticks with crummy roads, without large transports to move large components. I'd love to fill a couple of flatcars with, say, the wings or fuselage of a PT-17 but don't want to do that if there's no historical basis for it.

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Life member, 91st BG Memorial Association
Owner, 1944 Willys MB #366014
Former REMF (US Army, O3)

I'd suspect if any were, they'd have been in wooden shipping crates (there are some excellent shots of JRF4's and other GRUMMAN stuff being boxed for shipping buried in the GRUMMAN sticky. Given that 737 fuselages from Kansas regularly turn up in Renton with bullet holes in them after riding the BN across the midwest, I'll bet something as fragile as a STEARMAN wouldn't have been shipped un crated even light armored vehicles were protected by plywood covers over open areas like beds of half tracks, etc.
As far as I'm aware, there were only a very few aircraft modelled in 1/87th (HO scale) one was a stearman and the other was a DC-/C-47 both long ago by now long gone WILLIAMS BROS (they were typical W.B. issue, soft detail, and lots of work on rubbery plastic to make acceptable). and no major types kitted in that scale unless you find a one off oddball kit which has more value unbuilt. Even 1/76th scale armor is a bit large for scale.

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

Nearly every WWII training post with ~1000 or more people had a railroad siding or was situated near close rail access. Decisions to build the fields and camps was based on nearness of railheads for transportation of ALL materials- the interstate trucking system we depend on today was not developed anywhere near what it is today. Everything was moved by rail.

That said, most aircraft were manufactured, tested, and then flown to their destination of use unless they were to be shipped overseas. After that, if an aircraft had an accident that required higher-level overhaul than a base could handle, it could be disassembled and shipped for this overhaul at another location. However, with the scarce supply of parts in WWII, an aircraft which was beyond local repair capabilities might be cannibalized in place and some of those parts might be spread in the system to other bases. But those parts would have been very carefully crated and packed to handle rail or road travel.

I have O-gauge stuff (it's just for my kids, honest) and the way I would model this would be to put in a set sidings next to a crating operation. Where this would have been done was in base engineering section on the airfield- the aircraft would have been broken up, parts separated and crated, then shipped by rail or truck depending on how far they had to go. I just ran across this the other day when I was researching local military buildings. Just to the West of Marietta PA is a set of buildings which was used for this purpose in WWII. You can see the remains of the railhead where they loaded aircraft parts and pieces on the sidings between buildings- they were purpose built just for that operation.

http://maps.yahoo.com/#q=Marietta%2C+PA ... vt=s&trf=0

Marietta Air Force Depot was a storage facility for aircraft spares which was part of Middletown Air Depot in WWII. My friend's father worked there until they closed in the late 50's. Middletown Air Depot is now Harrisburg International Airpot. The Air Force Depot in Marietta was probably more elaborate than what you would see near a training or air base in the South- down there, you are talking just a siding with maybe some platforms to make it easier to load large crates.

For other ideas, I would refer to Thole's books entitled "Forgotten Fields." There are lots of photos of how air bases were layed out in WWII, including comprehensive aerial views which will show the rail sidings on or near the base.

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REMEMBER THE SERGEANT PILOTS!

I would recommend using 1:160th scale for two reasons.

1. Size
With this scaled down but equally as detailed size, your able to create a larger, more accurate diorama of whatever.

2. Aircraft
The general rule of thumb is; If you work with 1:160th scale, it's acceptable to use 1/144th scale aircraft. In the past 15 years the scale has exploded, with multiple niche garage companies, producing all sorts of resin models. Photo-etch sets, accessories, obscure aircraft, new vehicles; you name it, it probably exists.

Example
Check out this diorama of the Kingman, Arizona boneyard. Shows you the potential of what you can accomplish. If it was mine, I would have added some additional details, but as we all know, that's up to the modeler.

http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=200422&st=0

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Christopher Soltis
Dedicated to the preservation and education of The Sikorsky Memorial Airport

CASC Blog Page: http://ctair-space.blogspot.com/
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Chicks Dig Warbirds.......right?

I was more thinking of a damaged airplane, being brought back from a crash site not too far from the field (say, the next town over).
I already have some scale Jeeps all ready to go, will be using the WW2 load manual for RR operations, already have the chains, chocks and everything all made in that scale per the WW2 FM. Given the scale I'll be modeling in (1:48), I will have plenty of options. I'll be modeling a O scale narrow gauge layout that takes place in Tennessee in 1943 (which will also allow some representations of the troop movement for the wargames in that area at the time if I decide). The layout will be a fictional branch of an existing 3-foot gauge RR that ran between Tennessee and North Carloina until 1950.

I'm familiar with this setup, have seen it various places online.
I don't want to do a 'representational' type deal, I want to model as close as possible what you'd really see in that part of the country at that time. What few civilan cars on the layout will all have gas ration stickers in the windshields, for example. I've put that much thought into this.

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Life member, 91st BG Memorial Association
Owner, 1944 Willys MB #366014
Former REMF (US Army, O3)

I am thinking that having pot shots into railroad cargo was probably not a big problem in 1943. Just thinking.....

I agree about the crates. Each WACO CG-4 came in three huge wooden crates...plenty of wood back them.

If aircraft were shipped on railcars without crates, (and I personally don't think they were), they would have been wrapped in tarps similar to the photos we've seen of P-47s being sent to the ETO by ship.

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Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.
Note political free signature.
I figure if you wanted my opinion on items unrelated to this forum, you'd ask for it.

We can all speculate, I was hoping someone had actual photos of aircraft being moved by rail inside the zone of the interior...

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Life member, 91st BG Memorial Association
Owner, 1944 Willys MB #366014
Former REMF (US Army, O3)

They would have been in crates and not in the open.A company called Dade Bros. had the major contract for crate building of just about everything imaginable.P-40s were built and test flown at Buffalo and then disassembled and crated and shipped in Boxcars for autos to the left coast for shipment to the south pacific.P-40s headed toNorth Africa went as deck shippments and then flown off the deck.I believe the carrier was Ranger.Look at a picture of automobile boxcars and you will notice the full size doors on one end of car for ease of loading.I know Southern railway had these cars and so did other roads during the war.

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Hang The Expense

Pictures will be hard to come by during the war because it was against the law to photograph train movements or station or railyard activities.There are some books on the subject by I think LIFE magazine but that was all cleared by the gubmint.Still some good pics.

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Hang The Expense

Oh, like today when photography students are arrested by Officer Not So Friendly while doing class assignments and are busted for taking pictures of telephone wires crossing all in the name of 'Homeland Security' (insert your own dramatic echos here rererere)

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-

You got it.

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Hang The Expense

Just because you're paranoid, it doesn't mean they're not out to get you

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Don't make me go get my flying monkeys-