More 262 updates

[TimAPNY]

Some more good news from The Me-262 project, A few nice shots also.

http://www.stormbirds.com/project/general/updates.htm

I hope and can't wait to see one of these around the airshow circuit! What a sight that would be.

Allowing my self to dream a touch....
A flight of a Fw-190, Bf-109 and a Me-262, Being jumped by some P-47s and P-51s.

[Aircraft Mech Paul]

Excellent news,

and I agree...a "dream" flight of a FW-190, ME-109..or BF-109 (whichever you prefer), and an ME-262....that WOULD be quite a site on any airshow flightline.

Paul

[tom d. friedman]

great spread, but are we going to go through the political powder keg again on the absence of the swastika?? coming from this jewish aviation historian, i'm not offended, & PREFER IT'S PRESENCE ON THE TAIL OF THE 262 FOR HISTORICAL ACCURACY!!!!. sanitizing history does more damage to future generations than conveying the truth. this politically correct crap worries me. regards, tom

[bdk]

I believe it is not allowed by German law.

[tom d. friedman]

yeah, i know.... but it's redamneddiculous!!!

[DaveM2]

Swatikas are allowed on museum aircraft in Germany. It isn't only the Germany bound single seat 262 that hasn't got the swastika, the US owner of the B model hasn't elected to put one on either.

Dave

[Tigercat]

My opinion-------------this is political correctness run amock-----what a bunch of B.S.!!! Sanitizing of history is another example of "Progressive political thinking". It makes me mad-------grrrrrrrr!


Ted

[Aircraft Mech Paul]

Hi All,

Political Correctness aside here. I am all for brining these aircraft, from whatever nation that spawned them, back to life. However, I do believe that it is against the law to display the Swastika. But that aside I would agree on not displaying on several fronts. Not the least of which is that in the States, we have so many skinhead groups and their ilk, that would just love one more reason to spread their hate filled rhetoric, we don't need more of that kind of crap we need less. Our nation, in recent history has been through a lot of things...all on a national level from 9/11 to Hurricane Katrina. And during those times we see some of the best of us as a nation come out. We need more of that, and less of the hate speech that many would use to promote their rather tired and backwards agenda.

And secondly, as to the display of the nazi swastika. I think it would do us a genuine diservice, even within our Warbird community, to put something like that out in the public eye. Because it represents hate, violence and certainly not the best we as a nation have to offer. The German aircraft I have seen bear the "Cross" symbol and not the swastika of the Luftwaffe. I also think that allowing it to be portrayed in the public view, such as on a magnificently restored Warbird, would bring back so many very painful memories of those who served our armed forces and their loved ones. Many men lost their lives during that war.....

And finally, ask yourself this question. Remember when the movie "Saving Private Ryan" came out ? The footage of the D-Day Invasion brought so much back to the surface, due to it's very realistic portayal, of the vetereans who were THERE or who saw real combat during the war...that the emotion level was unbearable.

It has been said that we are loosing our Veterans of what Tom Brokaw wrote in his book as "The Greatest Generation", at what some say is the rate of 500-1000 per day. Do we not owe them the courtesy of honoring both them and their memory by doing the right thing here ?

I am not by any means a "politically correct" individual. But common descency MUST prevail in life.

Please forgive the brief editorial on my part, but I felt the somethings need to be spoken. And they should always be REMEMBERED.

Respectfully,

Paul

[B-29 Super Fort]

Paul a well said post, I agree.

[Tigercat]

Paul,

I must disagree with you as far as display of the swastika-----although I believe that it may stir emotions in some.

But, if it is so darn sinful to display an accurate national insignia on WWII German aircraft, what is your position on the display of the Japanese "meatball" or rising sun on their military aircraft? In my opinion the Japanese military was responsible for BY FAR more atrocities on American and British soldiers than the Germans ever performed. Also, ask the Chinese people about Japanese war crimes! If you have any doubts of their criminal acts, try reading the book "Prisoners of the Japanese" by Gavan Daws. There appears to be somewhat of a coverup of the unbelievable acts commited by the Japanese during WWII and that is mostly the fault of Hollywood and revisionist historians. But I hear no outcry to demand the banning of there national insignia from warbirds.

Yes, symbols do stir emotions in some individuals------and I don't believe that is a bad thing. It causes many of us to be more aware of the history we have experienced and its impact on our current times and our future.

[Oscar Duck]

Revisionist history only distorts the truth for future generations. I asked my father-in-law who is a combat B-17 veteran and flew against and was wounded in action by the Luftwaffe his opinion and he says that it is most imporatant that we DON'T sweep these issues under the carpet and tell it like it was.

[setter]

Hi all

Have to agree with Oscar - The aircraft didin't kill anybody - people did - It should look as it did in Wartime otherwise paint it orange and blue and call it the "Seattle Special " and send it to Reno. You can't really rewrite history - it just becomes fantasy.

Regards
John p

[agent86]

If you want to get down to the nitty gritty,The swastika predates the awful thousand year reich by many thousands of years and used by more than one society over time.therefore you can not just sweep it under the rug and pretend that it didnt appear.It did,they lost and it is a part of a major upheaval in our history and cannot be ignored like it wasnt there.Paint it on the planes!

[JägerMarty]

Some more good news from The Me-262 project, A few nice shots also.

http://www.stormbirds.com/project/general/updates.htm

I hope and can't wait to see one of these around the airshow circuit! What a sight that would be.

Allowing my self to dream a touch....
A flight of a Fw-190, Bf-109 and a Me-262, Being jumped by some P-47s and P-51s.

How about 5 of the new build 262s lining up behind a B17 or 2, pauke pauke!

[Firebird]

Political Correctness aside here. I am all for brining these aircraft, from whatever nation that spawned them, back to life. However, I do believe that it is against the law to display the Swastika. But that aside I would agree on not displaying on several fronts. Not the least of which is that in the States, we have so many skinhead groups and their ilk, that would just love one more reason to spread their hate filled rhetoric, we don't need more of that kind of crap we need less. Our nation, in recent history has been through a lot of things...all on a national level from 9/11 to Hurricane Katrina. And during those times we see some of the best of us as a nation come out. We need more of that, and less of the hate speech that many would use to promote their rather tired and backwards agenda.

And secondly, as to the display of the nazi swastika. I think it would do us a genuine diservice, even within our Warbird community, to put something like that out in the public eye. Because it represents hate, violence and certainly not the best we as a nation have to offer. The German aircraft I have seen bear the "Cross" symbol and not the swastika of the Luftwaffe. I also think that allowing it to be portrayed in the public view, such as on a magnificently restored Warbird, would bring back so many very painful memories of those who served our armed forces and their loved ones. Many men lost their lives during that war.....

And finally, ask yourself this question. Remember when the movie "Saving Private Ryan" came out ? The footage of the D-Day Invasion brought so much back to the surface, due to it's very realistic portayal, of the vetereans who were THERE or who saw real combat during the war...that the emotion level was unbearable.

It has been said that we are loosing our Veterans of what Tom Brokaw wrote in his book as "The Greatest Generation", at what some say is the rate of 500-1000 per day. Do we not owe them the courtesy of honoring both them and their memory by doing the right thing here ?

I am not by any means a "politically correct" individual. But common descency MUST prevail in life.

Please forgive the brief editorial on my part, but I felt the somethings need to be spoken. And they should always be REMEMBERED.

Why pick on the swastika...?
Why not the 'rising sun' of the Imperial Japanese, under whose banner were committed equally barbaric acts...??

I have yet to meet any veteran, who thinks that not putting on the swastika serves anything other than to draw attention to it and thereby it actually has the reverse effect to what the misguided PC brigade are trying to achieve.

Do these people really think, skin-head neo-nazi's and such like would really descend upon a museum and 'pay homage' to the tail fin of an old aeroplane, just because it had the swastika on it......
Get real......
Those nasty groups have a very different agenda, I know, I've seen it up close.

Provided it's in the correct historical context of course, I say put the ruddy thing on.
The law in Germany though is a different matter.