Warbird Information Exchange

Is anybody boiling up some crows for all the naysayers who have spent the last two decades castigating Ric Gillespie and Tighar? Because Bob Ballard, the world's best-known and most successful discoverer of underwater wreck sites--the Titanic being his best-known--has just announced that in cooperation with the National Geographic Society and with the help of Tighar he will be arriving in Nikumaroro in less than three weeks to begin a search for Amelia Earhart's Electra.

Ballard doesn't do wild goose chases. He has essentially said that he accepts the evidence of Earhart's landing at Niku in July 1937 that Gillespie and his troops have uncovered. Particularly the much-derided "landing-gear leg" photo, to which he specifically referred. And this has convinced him to take his deep-diving submersible (I believe it's called Nautilus) to Nikumaroro to do the deep search that Tighar could never support.

I consider this to be ample vindication of Gillespie's work. I'm proud to have been a member of Tighar since 1986.

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Taylor Stevenson

You can consider this proof of whatever you want, but it doesn't exactly make it so.
Ballard, like any good researcher, doesn't want to reinvent the wheel, so he's of course going to go to what appears to be the best source of info to start with (or in this case, the loudest).
Where Tighar made a laughing stock of themselves was the constant declarations that they'd solved the mystery with almost no evidence (and some of which later was proven to be laughable). The sad part of all this is that they might have solved the mystery at some point but nobody would know due to the "boy who cried Earhart" shtick from the group over and over.
If I was Ballard, though, I'd probably start with their data so I wouldn't go over the same stuff. There could be something useful there and Ballard is clearly no fool.
That doesn't mean that Tighar is going to provide any real help, though.

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Life member, 91st BG Memorial Association
Owner, 1944 Willys MB #366014
Former REMF (US Army, O3)

When did TIGHAR produce evidence of ANYTHING???

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Those who possess real knowledge are rare.

Those who can set that knowledge into motion in the physical world are rarer still.

The few who possess real knowledge and can set it into motion of their own hands are the rarest of all.

What are you talking about, Stephan? Tighar found AEs plane well over 10 years ago. Gillespie has made that abundantly clear.

I would think Ballard getting involved would be a repudiation of everything Tighar has claimed, since it is implicit that Ballard thinks there is something to find?

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Rob C

Historically, the claim of consensus has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to avoid debate by claiming that the matter is already settled. “

– Michael Crichton

When Ballard shows DNA proof of her
I will buy it

Until then

He's not looking for Earhart. He's looking for the aircraft. An Electra doesn't have DNA.

TIGHAR has already pronounced "Case closed" so RG doesn't seem to need any vindication from Ballard.

So if Ballard is a true TIGHAR believer, he'd save his time and diesel and stay tied to the quay.

I have a hunch this has more to do with producing a TV special and AE is a good "hook". Money has a way of making strange bedfellows.

TIGHARS "findings" on that out of the way island are circumstantial at best, certainly not enough to get anyone convicted of her murder if she was suspected of being buried there. The entire 'landing gear sticking out of water' thing is strange, it only makes sense if AE was going to land gear down...but why would she?


And if his interest is based solely on the blurry photo of the maybe...sorta...landing gear leg, I 'm not sure how much credit TIGHAR can claim since they did not take the photo. They may have publicized it, but I'm not sure if that elevated our safari suited friend to the level of Indiana Jones, let alone Howard Carter.

Stephan, I respect your opinion, but haven't you said in the past something along the lines of that RG is more of a charmer than scientist?

It's a shame that someone with Ballard's track record and reputation is getting mixed up with a group (and individuals) with TIGHAR's reputation.

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Remember the vets, the wonderful planes they flew and their sacrifices for a future many of them did not live to see.
Note political free signature.
I figure if you wanted my opinion on items unrelated to this forum, you'd ask for it.

You are splitting hairs, Stephan. Either you believe Gillespie or you don't. If you do, then all you are talking about is Ballard finding more parts to add to those already found. Big deal.

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Rob C

Historically, the claim of consensus has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to avoid debate by claiming that the matter is already settled. “

– Michael Crichton

What else is on the bottom of the ocean around there? While the search for Titanic was a dream of Ballard’s, it was largely bankrolled as a cover for a job to locate and investigate two sunken submarines for the US Navy that were in the same neighbourhood. Perhaps history is repeating itself.

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Keep 'em Flying.

Is this the correct place for TIGHAR PR BS, masquerading as 'news'?

But no, it doesn't vindicate TIGHAR because as we all know, TIGHAR has produced nothing of worth and neither, so far, has Robert Ballard.

There will be two outcomes here: (1) Ballard finds something* and TIGHAR can take some credit (but not be vindicated for anything other than pointing Ballard in a rough direction and certainly not defended for their behaviour) or (2) Ballard doesn't find anything and we all know what we already know.

My suspicion is that Ballard will eventually find something near Howland Island and TIGHAR will try to claim credit. RG will likely say he already had evidence (which no-one else knew about, obvs)

* "something" as in, something which can be 100% verified as Earhart/Noonan/Electra.

"Bob Ballard vindicates Tighar"? Not hardly. If he finds the airplane in the lagoon at Nikumaroro then yes, Tighar and Gillespie will be vindicated and I'll be the first guy in line to buy Ric a drink, take out a lifetime membership, and listen to him tell the tale of exactly how it all came together - but that's not where we're at, at least not yet. Your's is the kind of headline we've come to expect from Tighar HQ.

If Ballard goes hunting around Howland Island and ultimately doesn't find anything (a very strong possibility as it may have a) been scattered by the crash and then b) dissolved into nothing even remotely recognizable by now) there will always be this crowd of people incessantly heckling him going "You were in the wrong spot. If you'd gone to Nikumaror you'd have found it in the lagoon!" But if he goes there first and finds nothing then that voice effectively becomes silenced (read "Shutup and go away!") and he can then start fresh with no hassles from anyone. And maybe that's where it is, and if it is I hope he finds it. But Ballard is the real deal. When or if he says "We found it" you can darn well bet that he'll have conclusively, and without a shred of any doubt, have found it.

Now if only Paul Allen were still with us to vacuum it up and put it on display.

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

And in the case of number2, TIGHAR will simply say Ballard wasn't looking in the exact spot where they'd already 'proven' the Electra or remains was already found...
TIGHAR fans are like a cult. They remind me of Bigfoot hunters.

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Life member, 91st BG Memorial Association
Owner, 1944 Willys MB #366014
Former REMF (US Army, O3)

As the man said, "Bigfoot doesn't believe in you, either!"

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Defending Stearmans on WIX since Jeff started badmouthing them back in 2005.

I wish Ballard would take his search gear and start making passes up and down The English Channel.There has to be a bunch of semi-intact ditched planes and lots of boats.Maybe on the way to that Nikumoreau Island he could go find some of the Japanese carriers sunk near Midway.I think he tried earlier but ran out of time.I would rather see that than a beat up Lockheed.