White House Kills Constellation Program

[ripcord]

Here's my rant about this subject- Our education system teaches us how to memorize facts and formulas, but not how to actually think critically about anything. Science over the last twenty years has taken a back seat in the curriculum. How many people think humans co-existed with dinosaurs? We have lost the science initiative we had post WWII to any number of reasons including complacency. We take the technology we have for granted wthout thought as to where it came from, who thought it up, etc. Our culture has become used to instant gratification and this has hurt us as far as the ability to think things through and see the end outcome. The press will publish any story involving an airplane- "light bulb burns out on airliner!" and ignore the 40,000 killed in car crashes every year. There's plenty of blame to go around for this decision and it goes back to the Nixon administration when Apollo was killed.

[k5083]

The educational system where I live must be different than where you live. Where I live, a lot fewer people now think humans and dinosaurs co-existed than in, say, 1965. A lot of impressive science goes on in the schools, and the world still comes to the universities for state-of-the-art science training, despite our efforts to keep them away by jacking up foreign student tuition. R&D centers like Massachusetts, the NC triangle, Silicon Valley, increasingly even that wet rainy place with the teenage vampires are still the envy of the world. My son (age 6) came to me and asked about googol the other day (the number, not the search engine), something I didn't learn about until I was 13 or so. And somehow we do it all without having to digest about two-thirds of the people on the globe being evil enemies that we have to compete with.

Yes, overall, I'll take today over the 1960s, even if we don't have people circling the earth in tin cans. But it may be a function of place as well as time.

August

[PinecastleAAF]

I think the biggest shame is that the politicians (of all stripes) have led this country away from production and towards service. IMHO, America as a producer can and did so much for helping other nations rise up themselves and improving the standard of living in other places (competition is good for all). Having us as a 'service' country is a big step backwards.

I agree completely. We outsource everything now in the name of profit. This is not sustainable.

Government by Corporation, i.e. Corptocracy.

[mustangdriver]

I think that Mr. Obama needs to think how he would feel if he would have to go and tell three people face to face that he was killing our space program(and make no mistake that is indeed what he will be doing). He should think of how he would feel if he had to go and tell Grissom, Chaffee, and White, that the US no longer needs a space program. How many people here like the idea of hitching a ride with Russia or China? I don't. Another thing we are missing is that the moon served a very important purpose. It was going to be explored to see if we could in the future build a launching facility on the moon for future long distance space flights to fly further into space. Sound crazy and too far fetched?

"We choose to go to the moon. We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too."-JFK

Anybody want to tell him that we are ending the space program?

[k5083]

Well, of course Mr. O can't talk with the dead, as far as we know. (Some of his stronger supporters might not rule it out.) But I know someone who can. So I asked my demon-possessed cat to relay the message and let me know what they said in response. As before, I transcribed our conversation:

August: So did you find those guys?

Cat: Oh yeah, no problem. Jack was easy. He's big on the afterlife speaking circuit. Great speaker. Hey, did you know he cheated on Jackie?

August: There are rumors.

Cat: Uh-huh. Well, the other three still hang around the Cape a lot.

August: That has been rumored as well. So how did they take the news?

Cat: Actually they were all on board with it. Jack said that when he gave the speech about doing things that were hard, it seemed like there was lots of money around, and competing for military and engineering dominance was the most important thing. He notices we've got other problems now. If he gave the we-do-it-because-it's-hard speech now, he might be urging us to fix health care rather than go to the moon. Different times, different priorities.

August: Huh. What about the astronauts?

Cat: Gus, Ed and Rog aren't worried. Ed says he's seen space and that it's really big and isn't going anywhere. Also, he says Earth is really small and that it will be a lot easier for us to tackle space if the nations work together. Gus says we always did work together; even the moon landings weren't just a U.S. accomplishment; they couldn't have done it without a lot of German guys from the war, Canadians from Avro and Orenda, and other folks. So he figures that no matter who picks up the ball to explore space, it will still be a victory for the U.S. because of the contribution we made. Roger says that's the whole point of Neil's great line: these are giant steps for mankind, not just one country.

August: Wow. That's kind of a big picture view of things.

Cat: Absolutely. But they all still feel the U.S. will be a leader in space flight, even if NASA is not so involved. They're proud of what American private enterprise is accomplishing in space flight. Oh, and they're thrilled we beat Canada in hockey the other night, too. Jack said something about "ask not what your goalie can do for you," I didn't quite catch it.

August

[kzollitsch]

Of course opinions vary widely:

http://buzzaldrin.com/statement-from-buzz-aldrin-a-new-direction-in-space/

I tend to agree that going back to the moon is kind of pointless. Interesting sure, but why? What else can be learned from going back to the moon?

[bdk]

So I asked my demon-possessed cat to relay the message and let me know what they said in response. As before, I transcribed our conversation:

They're proud of what American private enterprise is accomplishing in space flight. Oh, and they're thrilled we beat Canada in hockey the other night, too.

Sounds like your feline is a free market puddy tat. He/she also seems to know that hockey is far more important in Canada than health care.

[k5083]

Sounds like your feline is a free market puddy tat. He/she also seems to know that hockey is far more important in Canada than health care.

They're closely related. The more hockey you play, the more health care you need.

August

[mustangdriver]

How can we say going to the moon was pointless, when the point of it was to try to explore further into space, using the moon as a pit stop of sorts. We all know that once you end something it is 10 times harder to restart it down the road.

The difference is back then we had a president that pushed us to be better, go forward, and dare to do what others said were to hard or impossible.. Now we hae a president that says, "Yup that is just to hard." I am neither Republican or Democrat, but I will say this. THis is the result of what happens when MTV gets to pick your president.

[k5083]

How can we say going to the moon was pointless,

Nobody (here) said going to the moon was pointless the first time (although others have). The second time is another matter.

when the point of it was to try to explore further into space, using the moon as a pit stop of sorts.

And did we get further into space last time? No. So maybe we should question the pit stop theory, as Buzz does.

We all know that once you end something it is 10 times harder to restart it down the road.

I didn't know we "knew" that. It kind of depends, don't you think?

The difference is back then we had a president that pushed us to be better, go forward, and dare to do what others said were to hard or impossible.. Now we hae a president that says, "Yup that is just to hard."

What is your source for that quote? You're just making stuff up. I don't think anyone doubts now, unlike in 1961, that going to the moon is easily within our capabilities. It actually isn't challenging enough to test us like it did then. We need a real reason to go. And it better be a good one, because we have problems here on the ground whose solutions make a trip to the moon look about as hard as building a model airplane.

I am neither Republican or Democrat, but I will say this. THis is the result of what happens when MTV gets to pick your president.

Now that is absurd. Everyone knows it was Oprah, not MTV. One thing for sure, voters had nothing to do with it.

August

[rreis]

There would be no man on the Moon without the Soviet Union.

[mustangdriver]

How can we say going to the moon was pointless,

Nobody (here) said going to the moon was pointless the first time (although others have). The second time is another matter.
Right, but I just told you why it is important to go again.

when the point of it was to try to explore further into space, using the moon as a pit stop of sorts.

And did we get further into space last time? No. So maybe we should question the pit stop theory, as Buzz does.
The last time just as it is this time, the government got in the way and stopped the Apollo flights. You can't look at mastering the place when you were first trying to see if you can land. We need time to try this.

We all know that once you end something it is 10 times harder to restart it down the road.

I didn't know we "knew" that. It kind of depends, don't you think?

No I don't think it depends. As that funding goes away, it will get used for something else, and then we will have to fight to get a space program back. Same goes with maintaining the equipment that is at the Cape. It will be more expensive.

The difference is back then we had a president that pushed us to be better, go forward, and dare to do what others said were to hard or impossible.. Now we hae a president that says, "Yup that is just to hard."

What is your source for that quote? You're just making stuff up. I don't think anyone doubts now, unlike in 1961, that going to the moon is easily within our capabilities. It actually isn't challenging enough to test us like it did then. We need a real reason to go. And it better be a good one, because we have problems here on the ground whose solutions make a trip to the moon look about as hard as building a model airplane.

I said that. That is my quote and I will stand by it. So you are sying that a moon base is so easy that no one has done it? I can think of no better reason to go forward into space than the fact that we don't know what is out there. As for those hard questions on the ground, get a real leader for president, and they will become less and less. Not easy fixes, but atleast some of them will get solved.

I am neither Republican or Democrat, but I will say this. THis is the result of what happens when MTV gets to pick your president.

Now that is absurd. Everyone knows it was Oprah, not MTV. One thing for sure, voters had nothing to do with it.

You joke, but it is true. The media picked this president. I have nothing against the man. I don't care about politics, until it gets in the way of life. I am not a narrow minded redneck that wouldn't vote for a black president. I think that him becoming president (even though I didn't vote for him) was part of what makes America Great. That we are a mixed group not afraid of color. Even though I did not vote for him, I was proud of my country. Now it is up to him to make me proud of him. So far, he is not doing so great.

August

[muddyboots]

chris, fix your quotes please...

[mustangdriver]

I don't know how. Ha Ha

[k5083]

That's okay, this will just go down as proof that I even argue with myself.

August