STALLS??? Woo-hoo...BFD
Wed Feb 28, 2007 8:14 pm
Did stalls today. WAAYY less scary than I thought they would be. I was thinking of spins instead of stalls. My instructor said, "Spins? Spins? We don't do no stinking spins." He said I did really well in stall recovery. Once I knew what the plane was and wasn't going to do, it was a snap.
My landings were a little better. Not much though. I gotta' stop being afraid to put it low enough for the ground effects to help me land.
I almost screwed up my "touch and go". Landed, went to full throttle and tried to use my runway markers to rotate where I usually do. OOPS! Forgot we didn't start at the beginning of the runway. I was only doing about 40k. No wonder it didn't want to fly. DUUUHHH
Back on Friday.
Mudge the learning
My landings were a little better. Not much though. I gotta' stop being afraid to put it low enough for the ground effects to help me land.
I almost screwed up my "touch and go". Landed, went to full throttle and tried to use my runway markers to rotate where I usually do. OOPS! Forgot we didn't start at the beginning of the runway. I was only doing about 40k. No wonder it didn't want to fly. DUUUHHH
Back on Friday.
Mudge the learning
Re: STALLS??? Woo-hoo...BFD
Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:25 pm
You might want to remember that those markers won't be at the same place when you fly to another airport either!Mudge wrote:Landed, went to full throttle and tried to use my runway markers to rotate where I usually do. OOPS! Forgot we didn't start at the beginning of the runway.
Look out the window, hear the engine and the wind, glance at the airspeed indicator...
Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:10 pm
Stalls are not bad the the piper. You really have to try to get it to do that. Now the Cessna will stall and spin.
Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:27 pm
Sounds like your having fun!
I think stalls are the most mis-understood part of flight from a non flyer point of view. "People" think the motor stalls and the thing falls out of the sky.
Thanks be to Hollywood.
I think stalls are the most mis-understood part of flight from a non flyer point of view. "People" think the motor stalls and the thing falls out of the sky.
Thanks be to Hollywood.
Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:34 pm
what cessna will stall and spin?
current standards are to teach incipient stalls – they want you to recover before the plane is actually in a developed stall (as opposed to being anywhere near a spin)
The standards have gone increasingly toward non-piloting skills. Let's all start flying clorox bottles with parachutes attached (oh, wait, then we'll just fly them into buildings, or into lake with Olympic gold medalists on-board . . .) (Oh, what am I saying, we already do that stuff)
Whatever the PTS says, I wouldn't solo a student until they have experienced stalls and spins, without the advantage of a forward CG.
I would think Bill G would have some insight here (future cfi and real plane pilot . . .)
current standards are to teach incipient stalls – they want you to recover before the plane is actually in a developed stall (as opposed to being anywhere near a spin)
The standards have gone increasingly toward non-piloting skills. Let's all start flying clorox bottles with parachutes attached (oh, wait, then we'll just fly them into buildings, or into lake with Olympic gold medalists on-board . . .) (Oh, what am I saying, we already do that stuff)
Whatever the PTS says, I wouldn't solo a student until they have experienced stalls and spins, without the advantage of a forward CG.
I would think Bill G would have some insight here (future cfi and real plane pilot . . .)
Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:09 am
Mudge,
Stalls are cake, as long as you do them right. Keep the wings level with the rudder and it will do what you want it to do. The first thing I would show students is how to use the trim wheel. I wouldn't solo a student until I could leave my hands on my lap. You will know when you are ready to solo, so don't set a time limit. Sounds like you are having fun. We always gave our students navy like call signs and rank, gave them the ideal to get on with there training
Lynn
Stalls are cake, as long as you do them right. Keep the wings level with the rudder and it will do what you want it to do. The first thing I would show students is how to use the trim wheel. I wouldn't solo a student until I could leave my hands on my lap. You will know when you are ready to solo, so don't set a time limit. Sounds like you are having fun. We always gave our students navy like call signs and rank, gave them the ideal to get on with there training
Lynn
Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:35 am
The wings are not level in a banking accelerated stall. Those will be fun when you do them.
And "no spins" thats like having all these people in this state that can't handle a bit of ice and snow on the roads driving a car.
You need to go in a spin rated plane and learn how to recover from them.
If you ever have it happen and can't recover or are too chicken, you could aggravate it and that will be the end.
I used to go up and do spins to clear my head. I remember going one time with my favorite old flight instructor and all we did was spins, till he had enough of that. The plane was a cessna 150.
And as far as using something on the field as a marker. Ah the airspeed indicator is your friend there. I think you would like a nice cessna 150 or a 172 it is like a kite compared to what your flying now.
And "no spins" thats like having all these people in this state that can't handle a bit of ice and snow on the roads driving a car.
You need to go in a spin rated plane and learn how to recover from them.
If you ever have it happen and can't recover or are too chicken, you could aggravate it and that will be the end.
I used to go up and do spins to clear my head. I remember going one time with my favorite old flight instructor and all we did was spins, till he had enough of that. The plane was a cessna 150.
And as far as using something on the field as a marker. Ah the airspeed indicator is your friend there. I think you would like a nice cessna 150 or a 172 it is like a kite compared to what your flying now.
Thu Mar 01, 2007 6:50 am
skybolt2003 wrote:what cessna will stall and spin?
current standards are to teach incipient stalls – they want you to recover before the plane is actually in a developed stall (as opposed to being anywhere near a spin)
The standards have gone increasingly toward non-piloting skills. Let's all start flying clorox bottles with parachutes attached (oh, wait, then we'll just fly them into buildings, or into lake with Olympic gold medalists on-board . . .) (Oh, what am I saying, we already do that stuff)
Whatever the PTS says, I wouldn't solo a student until they have experienced stalls and spins, without the advantage of a forward CG.
I would think Bill G would have some insight here (future cfi and real plane pilot . . .)
What I meant was that the Cessna is spin rated. At my flight school you were allowed to spin a 152 or 172. The Pipers PA28 was not spin cert. The Piper was also very tough to get a stall out of. You would get the shudder forever before it would break.
Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:01 am
In the stalls, I was waiting for the plane to start some semi-violent shudder.
My instructor did the first of each and I was thinking, "That's it? Where's the shudder?" I was expecting something kinda' scary. Needless to say, it didn't happen.
Another problem. I have a hearing loss in my left ear that prevents me from hearing high frequency sounds. The stall warning horn is one of those high pitched sounds that I can't hear. Of course, the horn is on my left side.
Don't know quite how I'm going to overcome that little problem. I guess, just don't stall the airplane.
Mudge the confident
("Don't get cocky, kid"
)
My instructor did the first of each and I was thinking, "That's it? Where's the shudder?" I was expecting something kinda' scary. Needless to say, it didn't happen.
Another problem. I have a hearing loss in my left ear that prevents me from hearing high frequency sounds. The stall warning horn is one of those high pitched sounds that I can't hear. Of course, the horn is on my left side.
Don't know quite how I'm going to overcome that little problem. I guess, just don't stall the airplane.
Mudge the confident
("Don't get cocky, kid"
)
Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:52 am
Mudge, the airplane will talk to you. Learn to feel it, not to listen for the horn.
?????
Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:11 am
I think stalls are the most mis-understood part of flight from a non flyer point of view. "People" think the motor stalls and the thing falls out of the sky.
Thanks be to Hollywood.
My cousin, Earl Carisle, ran a flying service out at Clover Field and was
killed in a crash there around 1927 when a young student froze and grabbed the stick. The newspaper headline screamed "DEATH SPIRAL KILLS TWO IN CRASH"!
Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:48 am
On my last flight before my Private check ride my instructor asked me if there was anything else I wanted to know while we were in the airplane.
I said sheepishly asked "can you show me a spin? "
He had big grin on his face (he was an old F-4 pilot ) and said "By all means, let's spin!"
Too bad I had to ask for it and that it is not mandated in training...because the first one really surprised me. It was good training that I have never had to use.
That was a fun time.
Z
I said sheepishly asked "can you show me a spin? "
He had big grin on his face (he was an old F-4 pilot
) and said "By all means, let's spin!"
Too bad I had to ask for it and that it is not mandated in training...because the first one really surprised me. It was good training that I have never had to use.
That was a fun time.
Z
Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:02 am
Yeah I agree with the idea that someone should at least SEE a spin, and have recovered from a few of them before going solo. I don't understand why there has been a trend to remove them from the training syllabus. Up here in Canada they're no longer a flight test item for the private, but they are for the commercial (for now anyways).
Mudge - If you can manage, try and get an hour in an airplane that will spin reasonably well just so you know what they're like. Much better time to make that discovery when there is someone in the back seat, then when you're on your own someday.
Of note - You'd like to get some tail dagger time anyways so you could likely accomplish both the spin training and the tail dragger flying in one go. Something like a Bellanca Citabria/Decathalon or a Supercub (I think) are both good options and will spin.
Keep up the progress and make sure you’re having a good time
Cheers
Ed
Mudge - If you can manage, try and get an hour in an airplane that will spin reasonably well just so you know what they're like. Much better time to make that discovery when there is someone in the back seat, then when you're on your own someday.
Of note - You'd like to get some tail dagger time anyways so you could likely accomplish both the spin training and the tail dragger flying in one go. Something like a Bellanca Citabria/Decathalon or a Supercub (I think) are both good options and will spin.
Keep up the progress and make sure you’re having a good time
Cheers
Ed
Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:12 am
It's my opinion that a good spin, loop, and roll course from a qualified individual is an important thing to get for any private pilot. I know others might disagree with that, but it's just my $.02 worth.
Gary
Gary
Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:18 am
Rick,
I don't care whether I hear the stall warning horn or not. I can feel when the a/c is stalling. Don't really need a gadget to tell me that.
The only thing I can see that it's good for is warning you of an eminent stall condition so you can start to correct before you get into a full blown stall. I guess what I could do, if I'm with an instructor or the FAA dude, is to take my headset off my left ear a bit when I think he/she might ask me to do a stall. I've got a David Clark X11 headset and it really cuts down on the noise.
Mudge the carefree
I don't care whether I hear the stall warning horn or not. I can feel when the a/c is stalling. Don't really need a gadget to tell me that.
The only thing I can see that it's good for is warning you of an eminent stall condition so you can start to correct before you get into a full blown stall. I guess what I could do, if I'm with an instructor or the FAA dude, is to take my headset off my left ear a bit when I think he/she might ask me to do a stall. I've got a David Clark X11 headset and it really cuts down on the noise.
Mudge the carefree