Warbird Information Exchange

Some ideas on the last part of the landing. As you fly the pattern, be at the right speed, altitude, spacing and finish the checklist early. On short final you are full flaps, perhaps 65K, and power off or a fast idle. You want to Begin to level off perhaps about 10 feet, so that by the time you reach about 3 feet you are a little nose up and barely descending. This round out and slowing the descent can be a smooth gradual thing, not a jerk all at once. When you add back pressure on the control wheel make it a gradual pressure and definite movement ,keep it going, but slow, not a jerk. Then as the plane tries to sink toward the runway just continue to hold it off, until there is no more flying speed and it settles onto the runway just at stall speed. If it first tries to climb or balloon as you pull back,either you have too much airspeed or you pulled the control wheel too fast. Don't push the wheel forward,just pause for a second. If you fly into the runway a little nose down, either you did not have enough sufficient speed or just didn't add back pressure. Remember to look down the runway a ways.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

Very good advice. I find to set up a good landing it's important to be right on your speeds, especially slowing down to your initial approach speed on base. As in, zero flaps approach speed.

Another suggestion I have is to practice the "flare" or "round out" in the air at altitude. Pick an altitude that you are going to decend to, then do your circuit (obviously in a practice area) and after you turn final, decend bleeding off the airspeed and like Bill said, hold it at that altitude using back pressure, and keep holding back until the stall. Just like you'd do on a regular landing. Stall the plane just (and I mean just) above the ground for a nice landing.

When you transition to faster, meaner airplanes the "stall" technique probably won't work so hot, but for slow flying taildraggers, the "stall" technique is good. Or at least that's what my instructor has been training me to do in the Fleet Canuck.

Good luck and always feel free to ask us questions.

Cheers,

David

Bill - given that the cockpit on your Spit is about a foot further forward than a standard one, have you noticed a difference in the visibility compared to the other (stock) ones you've flown? I'm imagining that you slip down final a little?

Dan

I would tell my students its like coming down a spiral staircase. With each turn from base to final, you should have lost 500'. You should ask yourself if you have the right sight picture, being that you are on the right glide path to land. From downwind to base and on to final its like coming down a set of stair and each 500' should lost should be like a landing on a staircase...

Lynn

Thanks troops. At altitude, I can do the power off stalls, full flaps, with no problem and lose very little altitude when recovering. I think my problem has mainly to do with the fact that, in the back of my mind, I know the ground is considerably harder than the imaginary one at altitude.
I'm still thinking, "Don't slam it on the ground" and over-correct resulting in a BIIGG flare. If I can progress from landings 3 & 4 on Friday (SMOOOOTH) I just might conquer my problem.
Thanks again for the help. I'm sure some of you are thinking, "SHEESH, what an uncoordinated klutz!"

Mudge the appreciative

ps. From the looks of the weather, I may not get to fly this week. Winds are showing 12-15k every day.

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Land of the free because of the brave

Dan, you are well informed. To convert my single Spitfire MKIX into the dual cockpit version, the front cockpit was moved forward 13"by the factory in Southhampton. Only a master pilot of superior eyesight, superb hand-eye coordination and marvelous touch could possibly land such a demanding machine. And if you believe this there is a nice aluminiam comb for sale on Ebay of only $880K. Actually I haven't had enough time in other Spits to really compare this. When I flew the Russell MkIX to Thunder show at Willow Run this summer, I had not even taxied it before rolling out on the first landing. We had several days of prep to get the four planes ready, but heavy rain had made the grass runway unusable. We towed the planes out to the runway and it was just dry enough that we were able to get off late that Friday afternoon. When sitting in the cockpit and hangar flying, I did notice there seemed to be a little more nose in view, but once off airborne and gear up it was a Spitfire. The main thought I had was how lucky I was to have this chance, after my plane had a tailwheel problem; and most of all not to do anything foolish in Ed's very valuable plane. The radios were much different than my plane; this was a bit of a problem with the 3 freqencies in use at YIP; and the gear operation in my plane is simpler, so each cycle took me a little extra time to verify. Just flying the plane presented no real problem,except it is very hard to get a Spit to slow down to the 80mph final approach speed, especially until the flaps are lowered. If you just hold it off 3pt. gentle full stall that plane especially rolls true after landing. Some years ago I flew a single MkXVI and had no problem at all with that landing after about a 45 min flight. It was a clip wing and a joy in the limited acro I did.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

Interesting - thanks. 80mph down final is about the same speed as a C-185. I've heard the Spit likes to roll straight down the runway - obviously a creature of true breeding. You must just about sit right on the c of g in your plane being that far forward - what's the max weight for the backseater - I would expect the envelope is fairly short. It kind of goes against conventional thinking but I find the Stearman to be alot easier to fly from the rear seat as you can see so much more (not that you can see over the nose from either seat) but it seems like you can see around the nose alot easier from back there.

Thanks for the gen, hope you don't mind the questions.

Dan, for cg consideration my back seat weight limit is 185 lbs, I have flow it with a little more, but you don't get full normal handling. For ferry trips they sometimes flew them way aft cg, but had to be very carefull until burning off fuel.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

Thanks Bill - that's close to what I would have guessed. I had a good look at your airplane at Oshkosh a few years ago and it still suprises me how small the Spitfire is. Nice bird.

Dan

Mudge are you getting any good weather there yet? Yesterday I rode my bike for the first time, today woke up to an inch of snow; it is the last week if ski season. If it is too windy for you to fly, but others are you might learn somethng by watching others land.

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Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK

The wheels point down.

Couldn't fly yesterday. Wind gusts to 20K. Forecast is the same for tomorrow.
O2...Thanks for the tip.

Mudge the frustrated

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Land of the free because of the brave

Put the velocity vector in the HUD right on the threshold, then modulate power to maintain 20-22 units of AOA on final...you can back up the AOA by calculating a final approach speed manually: Start with a reference speed of 155 KCAS and add two knots for every thousand pounds of fuel or ordnance on board the jet.

When you're over the over-run, gently pull the power to idle and shift your aimpoint from the threshold to about 2/3 down the runway. Hold this attitude for a moment until the threshold passes beneath you, then increase the back pressure just slightly enough to arrest the sink rate. As Bill said, if you don't touch down right away, hold the landing attitude and wait for it, or you may also fan the speed brake and this will kill your airspeed and lift quickly.

Should be enough to get you going with the Warrior, right?

Randy...Thank for all the helpful tips. Other than the fact that I have no ordnance, no speed brakes, only about 300 lbs of fuel max., and the 155k just ripped the wings off...everything else was really usable stuff.

Mudge the medically approved

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Land of the free because of the brave

Do they teach spin training these days, Mudge?