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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 10:33 am 
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Link from CNN:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/07/12/search.amelia.ap/index.html

Just out of curiosity, why doesn't TIGHAR invest heavily in a towed sonar array, or do a joint expedition with the Woods Hole folks to explore the ocean bottom around Howland Island? It would take a while, sure, but it would seem if they were REALLY interested in solving the mystery of Earhart's disappearance, they'd be investigating a water landing with equal fervor.

Lynn


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:07 am 
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Becuse then TIGHAR have to share the glory of the find with someone else!
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:20 am 
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Hmmm...the article reads like something out of a tabloid. :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:53 am 
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Amelia was a sucky pilot and Fred Noonan was a washed up naviagator.
They got lost, crashed at sea and fed the crabs. End of story. :shock: :idea:
Jack who's sick of Tighar and Amelia. :!:

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:56 am 
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I lost my score book, could someone please tell me how many times they have claimed to have solved the mystery, or were at least pretty sure they found her? :lol:


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 5:03 am 
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Being one who has read a LOT about this story, I'd still like some definitive proof of what happened to Amelia. I seriously doubt that TIGHAR will find that proof, however; I think they proved their incompetence long ago. Forget about the bones -- FIND THE AIRPLANE!!

Jack, you forgot to say that Noonan was a "drunken", washed up navigator.

This tidbit from the CNN story is hilarious:

"Kar Burns, one of two anthropologists on the team, hopes coconut crabs native to the island -- some as big as 2½ feet across -- will carry the pig bones to wherever human bones might have been taken by crabs. DNA from human bones could help solve the mystery, Gillespie said."

Maybe the crabs should eat Gillespie and carry his bones to their bone disposal site.

Dave


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 5:55 am 
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Anyway...

Everyone knows that Amelia is up in space with Lord Lucan, Elvis, Shergar and the 5 TBM-3's of Flight 19


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 7:32 am 
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To be fair, TIGHAR may suck. Give credit where credit is due. She did fly the Atlantic in a Vega. You might try soloing a Vega.

Fred Noonan on the other hand was certainly a professional. He mapped the pacific when it had no such thing. Earhart had paid for a professional and she got one. What they actually did on that trip will probably never be known.

Off Wikipedia...

Noonan was born in Cook County (Chicago), Illinois. His parents were Joseph T. Noonan (born in Maine around 1865) and Catherine Egan (born in England). Noonan's father died when he was four, and three years later a census report lists him as living alone in a Chicago boarding house, although relatives or family friends were likely caring for him. In his own words, Noonan "left school in summer of 1905 and went to Seattle, Washington,"[2] where he found work as a seaman.

At the age of 15, Noonan shipped out of Seattle as an ordinary seaman on a British sailing bark, the Compton. Between 1910 and 1915, Noonan worked on over a dozen ships, rising to the ratings of quartermaster and bosun's mate. He continued working on merchant and Royal Navy ships throughout the First World War. Serving as an officer on munitions ships, his harrowing wartime service included being on three vessels that were sunk by U-boats. [3] After the war, Noonan continued in the merchant marine and achieved a measure of prominence as a ship's officer. Throughout the 1920s, his maritime career was characterized by steadily increasing ratings and "good" (typically the highest) work performance reviews. Noonan married Josephine Sullivan in 1927 at Jackson, Mississippi. After a honeymoon in Cuba they settled in New Orleans.


[edit] Navigator for Pan Am
Following a distinquished 22-year career at sea that included sailing around Cape Horn seven times (on three occasions under sail)[3], Noonan contemplated a new career direction. After learning to fly in the late 1920s[3], he received a "limited commercial pilot's license" in 1930, on which he listed his occupation as "aviator." The following year he was awarded "license #121190, Class Master, any ocean,"[4] the qualifications of a ship's captain.[5] During the early 1930s, he worked for Pan American World Airways as a navigation instructor in Miami and an airport manager in Port-Au-Prince, Haiti, eventually assuming the duties of inspector for all of the company's airports.

In March 1935, Noonan was the navigator on the first Pan Am Sikorsky S-42 clipper at San Francisco Bay. In April, he navigated the historic, round-trip China Clipper flight between San Francisco and Honolulu, piloted by Ed Musick (who was featured on the cover of Time magazine that year). Noonan was subsequently responsible for mapping Pan Am's clipper routes across the Pacific, participating in many flights to Midway and Wake Island, Guam, the Philippines and Hong Kong. In addition to more modern navigational tools, the licensed sea captain was known for carrying a ship's sextant on these flights.

1937 was a year of transition for Fred Noonan, whose reputation as an expert navigator, along with his role in the development of commercial airline navigation, had already earned him a place in aviation history. The tall, very thin, brown-haired and blue-eyed 43-year-old navigator was living in Los Angeles. He resigned from Pan Am because he felt he had risen through the ranks as far as he could as a navigator, and had interest in starting a navigation school. In March, he obtained a divorce from his wife Josie in Juarez, Mexico. Two weeks later, he married Mary Bea Martinelli (born Passadori) of Oakland, California. Noonan was rumored to be a heavy drinker, but this was fairly common during the era and there is no evidence it ever interfered with his reliability or accuracy as a navigator.[6]


Earhart world flight
Amelia Earhart met Noonan through mutual connections in the Los Angeles aviation community and chose him to serve as her navigator on her World Flight in the Lockheed Electra 10E she had purchased with funds donated by Purdue University, a circumnavigation of the globe at equatorial latitudes. Although the aircraft was of an advanced type and dubbed a "flying laboratory" for the press, little real science was planned, the world was already criss-crossed with commercial airline routes (many of which Noonan himself had first navigated and mapped) and the flight is now widely regarded as an adventurous publicity stunt. Noonan was probably attracted to the project because Earhart's mass market fame would almost certainly generate huge publicity, which in turn could reasonably be expected to attract attention to him and the navigation school he hoped to establish when they returned.

The first attempt began with a record-breaking flight from Burbank, California to Honolulu. However, as the plane was taking off to begin the second leg to Howland Island, its wing clipped the ground, Earhart cut an engine to maintain balance, the plane looped and the landing gear collapsed. Although there were no injuries, the Electra had to be shipped back to Los Angeles for expensive repairs. Over a month later they tried again, this time leaving California in the opposite direction.


Earhart and Noonan by the Lockheed L-10 Electra during their World Flight, 1937.Earhart characterized the pace of their 40-day, eastward trip from Burbank to New Guinea as "leisurely." They took off from Lae on 2 July 1937, and headed for Howland Island, a tiny sliver of land in the Pacific Ocean, barely 2,000 metres long. The plan for the 18-hour flight was to reach the vicinity of Howland using Noonan's celestial navigation skills, then find the island using radio navigation signals sent by the United States Coast Guard cutter Itasca. Through a series of misunderstandings or mishaps (which are still controversial), over scattered clouds, the final approach was never accomplished, although Earhart indicated by radio they believed they were in the immediate vicinity of Howland. Two-way radio contact was never established and the fliers disappeared over the western Pacific. Despite an unprecedented, extended search by the U.S. Navy and Coast Guard, no physical evidence was found [7]

Later research showed that Howland's position was misplaced on their chart by approximately five nautical miles. There is also motion picture evidence that a belly antenna on the Electra may have snapped on takeoff (the purpose of this antenna has not been identified and radio communications seemed normal as they climbed away from Lae).[citation needed]

It is possible, even likely, that having run out of fuel, Earhart ditched the Electra in the ocean where she perished with her navigator. However, in her last message received at Howland, Earhart reported that they were flying a standard line of position (or sun line), a routine procedure for an experienced navigator like Noonan. This line passed within sight of Gardner Island (now Nikumaroro) in the Phoenix Group to the southeast and there is a range of documented, archaeological and anecdotal evidence supporting an hypothesis that Earhart and Noonan found Gardner, which at the time was uninhabited, landed the Electra on a flat reef near the wreck of a large freighter and sent sporadic radio messages from there.[citation needed]Other sources have indicated Noonan may have succumbed to either injuries or exposure rather quickly, while Earhart may have survived as a castaway for a period of months. For example, in 1940, Gerald Gallagher, a British colonial officer and licensed pilot, radioed his superiors to inform them he believed he had found Earhart's skeleton, along with a sextant box, under a tree on the island's southeast corner.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 8:34 am 
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New search begins in Earhart mystery By RICHARD PYLE, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jul 12, 5:49 AM ET



NEW YORK - Hoping modern technology can help them solve a 70-year-old mystery, a group of investigators will search a South Pacific island to try to determine if famed aviator Amelia Earhart crash-landed and died there.




The expedition of 15 members of the International Group for Historic Aircraft Recovery, or TIGHAR, was set to depart Thursday. The trip would mark the group's ninth to Nikumaroro, an uninhabited atoll about 1,800 miles south of Hawaii.

Once at the 2 1/2-mile-long island, the group was to spend 17 days searching for human bones, aircraft parts and any other evidence to try to show that Earhart and her navigator, Fred Noonan, reached the island on July 2, 1937, crashed on a reef at low tide and made it to shore, where they possibly lived for months as castaways, written off by the world as lost at sea.

The conditions during the search will be punishing, with the explorers forced to contend with dense jungle vegetation, 100-degree heat, sharks that reside in a lagoon in the middle of the island and voracious crabs that make it necessary to wear shoes at all times.

"The public wants it solved. That's why everybody on the street today, 70 years later, knows the name Amelia Earhart," said TIGHAR founder and executive director Ric Gillespie. "She is America's favorite missing person."

At the time, Earhart, 39, and Noonan, 44, were nearing the end of a much-publicized round-the-world flight that had begun more than a month earlier in Oakland, Calif. On July 2, they left Lae, New Guinea, bound for tiny Howland Island, 2,550 miles to the east, only to vanish as they neared their destination.

A 16-day search by U.S. Navy and Coast Guard ships turned up no sign of the fliers or their silver, twin-engine Lockheed Electra. Despite an official finding that they ran out of gas and crashed in the ocean, the case spawned a once-popular claim that the pair were captured and executed as spies on a Japanese-held island.

Gillespie acknowledges that some critics regard the Nikumaroro castaway theory as far-fetched, but he says there is strong evidence to suggest Earhart and Noonan reached what was then known as Gardner Island, 350 miles south of Howland, and survived a crash-landing on its wide flat reef.

"Most skeptics are not really familiar with the evidence that we've found, and they usually have a vested interest in the other theories — that they crashed at sea or were captured by the Japanese," he said.

The evidence includes radio distress signals that may have come from Earhart, bones found at a former campsite in 1940, and pieces of airplane parts that Gillespie says could have come from Earhart's plane. One of these is a shard of Plexiglas, the exact thickness and curvature of an Electra window, but with no serial number.

The bones, found by a British overseer in 1940 and first judged to belong to a mixed-race male, vanished in Fiji during World War II. But a doctor's notes, discovered in London in 1998, were reanalyzed by two American forensic anthropologists, who found the remains were more likely those of a Caucasian female about Earhart's age and height.

Metal detectors, digital cameras slung from kites, infrared-equipped surveying devices and even pig bones are among items TIGHAR planned to use for the expedition. The search will concentrate on two locations: the campsite where bones were found in 1940, and a site where aircraft parts were recovered.

Kar Burns, one of two anthropologists on the team, hopes coconut crabs native to the island — some as big as 2 1/2 feet across — will carry the pig bones to wherever human bones might have been taken by crabs. DNA from human bones could help solve the mystery, Gillespie said.

The group — mostly veterans of previous trips to the island — includes engineers, environmentalists, a land developer, archaeologists, a sailboat designer, a team doctor and a videographer.




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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 2:07 pm 
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And? Your point being?

Dave


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 8:44 pm 
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the crash of the french earhart st. experate was found a while back........... dubbed the french earhart, so anything is possible. as for tighar..... while their goal is admirable, they are a bunch of the biggest publicity seeking snake oil salesmen i've ever seen.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 9:02 pm 
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Maybe the crabs should eat Gillespie and carry his bones to their bone disposal site.

OK now that's funny :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 9:09 pm 
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Jack, I think even crabs have standards about what they'll eat ! :shock:


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:09 pm 
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I am still a new guy around the block, so what is up with that TIGHAR place? Who are they, and what have they done?

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:23 pm 
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I'll try to be tactful,in order of your questions, publicity seekers, imposters and not a darn thing , ( except spend inordinate amounts of money and made dubious calims based on sketchy circumstantial dubious evidence ) But for some reason anytime they put out a press release the mainstream media goes ga ga.


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