Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:04 pm
mustangdriver wrote:me109me109 wrote:HELLDIVERS wrote:Key word: Heard...
Well that would have been from the director of the museum but what does he know?
The director of the museum is a she... do you mean the president of the organization? If so I would LOVE for you to send me any details on that conversation...
The Director of the NMUSAF is with out a doubt a man.
I thought you were refering to the CAF... my mistake... Personally I support the CAF and do not approve of MANY things the NMUSAF does, but I'm sick of argueing over this. You or I wont change the outcome, we shall just wait and see what happens...
Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:10 pm
We are all good man. I am a huge supporter of the NMUSAF, and I also support the CAF. In this case I really don't have an opinion just so the plane ends up with who rightfully owns it.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:34 pm
mustangdriver wrote:...just so the plane ends up with who rightfully owns it.
I would agree with that statement. However, if in fact it is decided that the USAFM is the rightful owner, I just hope they don't end up with one beautifully restored P-82 indoors and TWO deteriorating on outside display. I understand that the owners have every right to do what they want with their property but I don't have to agree with it. I understand that a ruling in favor of the CAF does not guarantee the future of the airplane but I really think that it stands a better chance of being properly cared for outside of USAFM ownership. Last but not least, I would much prefer to see this airplane flying than on static display either insider or outside. Time will tell.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:48 pm
I think that the aircraft would be in better care with the NMUSAF. The good thing about it ending up with the CAF is that we might see it fly sometime.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 5:23 pm
Chad Veich wrote: Last but not least, I would much prefer to see this airplane flying than on static display either inside or outside.
That sentence sums it all up. End of argument...
Sat Oct 06, 2007 6:49 pm
I'm inclined to agree with those who wish to see and hear this bird fly again. I want to run to the door or go to an Airshow to see these rare birds doing what they do best, flying. I don't find myself getting all charged up going to a non flying museum where the planes are roped off and are reduced to just another man made object.
David
David
Sat Oct 06, 2007 6:55 pm
I prefer to see it with a group that will restore it to a high standard. Now if this can be done with a flying museum, great, but if it goes back to the NMUSAF I am sure that they will find a good home for a static restoration.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:29 pm
Restorations are fine, but airworthy is more important in my book. I prefer to see a warbird dirty or with paint flaking like it was when it was working. I'd love to see a P-51 like Jack Cook posted of "Tex Hill's" on the show circuit right now, "War Weary".
The NMUASF does a fine job, but the gov't has enough of these airplanes. Let the private individual who has the means and the will to fly these birds for all of us to enjoy. Airplanes are meant to fly!
As passionate as you are to see the NMUSAf have this airplane to display static, I'm to see it fly. The more of them we allow to slip through our fingers to static status the fewer we will have to enjoy.
David
The NMUASF does a fine job, but the gov't has enough of these airplanes. Let the private individual who has the means and the will to fly these birds for all of us to enjoy. Airplanes are meant to fly!
As passionate as you are to see the NMUSAf have this airplane to display static, I'm to see it fly. The more of them we allow to slip through our fingers to static status the fewer we will have to enjoy.
David
Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:32 pm
I have no problem with it flying at all, just so it is well maintained. Let's face it is needs some TLC. I don't mean to say that the CAF isn't capable of doing it, it just needs to be done.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 8:19 pm
If it stays with the caf it will fly... if it goes to the nmusaf it will sit outside and rot or be placed in a museum as a static restoration.... i'm sure you would all agree that you'd rather see the aircraft fly...
???
Sat Oct 06, 2007 8:26 pm
If it stays with the caf it will fly.
I thought the whole issue was the CAF wants to be rid of it
and was trading it off??
Re: ???
Sat Oct 06, 2007 8:36 pm
Jack Cook wrote:If it stays with the caf it will fly.
I thought the whole issue was the CAF wants to be rid of it
and was trading it off??
That is the ONLY reason that the NMUSAF is involved in this at all.
Re: ???
Sat Oct 06, 2007 9:38 pm
mustangdriver wrote:Jack Cook wrote:If it stays with the caf it will fly.
I thought the whole issue was the CAF wants to be rid of it
and was trading it off??
That is the ONLY reason that the NMUSAF is involved in this at all.
If the NMUSAF hadn't gotten involved it would probably be flying now and part of a world class aviation museum that is being constructed in Colorado.
I, like others, find it interesting they are so concerned about this P-82 but not the all the other rare aircraft they have sitting outside. (P-38, P-47, F-82, B-17s, B-25s, P-51s) etc. Anyone who thinks that leaving these aircraft outside isn't destructive is uneducated on preservation and restoration, and the metallurgy of these aircraft.
Those who think that the NMUSAF is doing a good job of perserving all of its airplanes should go visit the Armament Museum at Eglin and take a look at the B-25. Another ten years and the wings won't be on it because the attach angles will have fallen apart. The facility in Dayton is world class, but they don't have the resources to protect and maintain all the aircraft in their collection. They don't need more.
As a side note, didn't the NMUSAF just let an F-84 in Wisconsin that is under their supervision be scrapped?
Sat Oct 06, 2007 10:11 pm
First, would someone please pass the Kool Aid to Mustang Driver ? Apparently he is thirsty again !
By his own count Gen Metcalf says HE controls over 3000 aircraft around the world and will continue to do as he sees fit, when he sees fit. " This is a near quote from a the speech he made at this year's Warbird Conference at NMUSAF. Does he really need 3001 ? Apparently, there were other tidbits of arrogance handed out to the warbird operators in the audience
MD, have you ever seen the birds at Lackland ? There are some extremely rare types there. P-47, F-82, EC-121, P-51H, real RP-63 complete with all armor and lights, B-17, B-25, A-26, B-29, and many others. They are ALL outside and have been for over 30 years. The paint on them has varied from all siver with minimal markings to semi correct colors with minimal markings. Outside appearances are usually tolerable but inside,...who knows. I still say that it's borderline criminal for ANY of these types ( especially the smaller examples ) to be outside in this day and age.
By his own count Gen Metcalf says HE controls over 3000 aircraft around the world and will continue to do as he sees fit, when he sees fit. " This is a near quote from a the speech he made at this year's Warbird Conference at NMUSAF. Does he really need 3001 ? Apparently, there were other tidbits of arrogance handed out to the warbird operators in the audience
MD, have you ever seen the birds at Lackland ? There are some extremely rare types there. P-47, F-82, EC-121, P-51H, real RP-63 complete with all armor and lights, B-17, B-25, A-26, B-29, and many others. They are ALL outside and have been for over 30 years. The paint on them has varied from all siver with minimal markings to semi correct colors with minimal markings. Outside appearances are usually tolerable but inside,...who knows. I still say that it's borderline criminal for ANY of these types ( especially the smaller examples ) to be outside in this day and age.
Sat Oct 06, 2007 10:32 pm
MD, have you ever seen the birds at Lackland ?
I have... and now there's even less excuse for them to sit there as they're harder than ever to see since security has gotten tighter. At this point I wish they could get fiberglass replicas up and get the real aircraft there preserved or transferred to someone who'll get them flying.
Ryan