TEXAS RAIDERS- First Flight in Seven Years- Oct. 14, 2009

[Steve Nelson]

I don't think that's a replacement wing in the photo. Many period shots of Forts show different color/weathering on the outer wings. These (like the vertical stab) were built and painted by subcontractors, using different paint, which faded and weather differently. They also could have used up old-stock wings, which had already been painted with the red-bordered insignia. There were actually cases of B-17s leaving the factory in bare metal with camo outer wings and fins..in some cases they were overpainted with silver, sometimes stripped, sometimes left as-is.

Looking at the Princess Pat photo, I thought the #1 & #2 nacelles were just extremely dirty, but then I noticed the dark spot on the fuselage, and the dark leading edge..and realized it's the shadow of the wing of a plane above.

SN

[Second Air Force]

Your're right about that shadow, Steve--I was just trying to give Spanner a break from scrubbing with his assortment of toothbrushes. I agree that many subassemblies came out different color, primarily the vertical fin on the B-17s, but I do believe that wing panel is a replacement. Pat was a B-17G-15-VE aircraft, and by that time the red surround was no longer being painted on by the manufacturer. The 381st had plenty of F models to get parts from--that's why I think she has had a replacement panel installed.

Scott

[Steve Nelson]

Thanks for the info..no doubt B-17s got absolutely filthy in service. One thing that's very clear in the pic, and that almost every model builder gets wrong, is that the areas behind the wing vents should be clean, since all that comes out of them is hot air. Almost every modeler paints big black streaks behind them, assuming they're "exhaust" vents of some kind. Even one of the real B-17s given faux "weathering" for the 1990 movie "Memphis Belle" had big black stains behind the vents.

Speaking of wing vents, are those vents near the wingtips on "PP" for the long-range "Tokyo" tanks?

SN

[Second Air Force]

Yup, those tip vents are for the Tokyo tanks. Another cool thing about the oil and exhaust staining on the wings is the effect of the propwash on them--modelers used to simply streak the staining straight back rather than directing it in the correct direction on the wing surface. I know because I did it!

Scott

[SPANNERmkV]

TOO LATE SCOTT !!!
I already cleaned them.

Very observant Steve. The shadow may even be from the plane that took the picture. And because it blends right in to the natural patina of round engine corrosion controlling agent I thought it was all engine spew!

My great accomplishment this weekend was pulling the carbs from #1 and #4 engines. (NOTE to self... Don't lose the cup washers for the carb. bases... they appear to be made out of unobtainium.)

# 2 is already rebuilt and #3 is on a pallet where I can't get to it.
Photos will be forthcoming showing why it was a good idea to rebuild this APART from the fact that we needed to re-fresh the O-rings in the hydraulic cowl flap actuators and you can't get them out without removing the carbs. first.
UNLESS you have teeny tiny hands and you like to swear a lot!

[retroaviation]

Thanks for the info..no doubt B-17s got absolutely filthy in service. One thing that's very clear in the pic, and that almost every model builder gets wrong, is that the areas behind the wing vents should be clean, since all that comes out of them is hot air. Almost every modeler paints big black streaks behind them, assuming they're "exhaust" vents of some kind. Even one of the real B-17s given faux "weathering" for the 1990 movie "Memphis Belle" had big black stains behind the vents.
SN

Well......that area could be black, if you have some leaking oil coolers...which I'm sure happened from time to time.

Gary

[Steve Nelson]

What, you mean airplanes actually leak oil? Somebody better look into that...

SN

[SPANNERmkV]

T'was a dirty job, but someone had to do it! Where the carb. USED to be!

No probs getting the carb up and over the engine mount! Piece O' Cake!

Victory! NOTE: the wise old owl tried to tell me he'd rather have a root canal performed by a Proctologist than pull a carb. off an R-1820 Dash 97

Now WHY did the Maintenance Officer think this needed re-furbishing? hmmmmm

Last edited by SPANNERmkV on Wed May 28, 2008 3:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Second Air Force]

Well, at least the impeller looks nice! You did put a cover on there, right?

S

[SPANNERmkV]

I made two intake covers and ONE discovery...

Always drill the holes BEFORE you cut the cover to shape.
I had just cut the first one from a pattern and took it to the drill press and CRRRRRRRRRRAAAACK
the board split.
Another "Oh Fiddlesticks" moment!

But yes, I did put covers on both orifices.

I had ALWAYS wondered about the R-1820s being referred to as "turbo-supercharged" and now I know why.
The Education continues!

[skymstr02]

You may also consider treating that corrosion on the magnesium castings on the accessory housing and on the intake elbow into the carb.

[SPANNERmkV]

Consider it considered!!!

(we didn't take it ALL apart just to put it back together ALL skanky!)

[Lynn Allen]

Ah yes, bolt the carb back on, no sweat. On the R-2600 you have to bolt it to the rubber bellow and with really small long fingers tighten the bolts, oh what fun that was

Lynn

[RickH]

You haven't lived until you spend the better part of the day scrunched up in the accessory section of an A-26. After you get the monster carb on you have to fit the boot on which is attached to the upper cowling. That's not the hard part, the clamp that goes around the boot has a long wing nut to secure it. You can't see it , you can only feel it, it's a bear to get started ( you'll swear its to short to reach ) then after all of that you have to safety wire it. After you fall out of the hole you've been crunched up in it seems like the better part of the day to unfold and restore flexibility.

[K5DH]

Speaking of turbosuperchargers, try changing one on a B-17, with all of that ductwork and a zillion little "invisible" bolts that are arm's length up inside the nacelle and that you can barely feel with your fingertips, let alone see or get a proper wrench on.

Cheers!