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Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:28 am

Likely the biggest delay they will experience in returning this one to the air will be getting a replacement prop.

I'd say I'll be the gear being twisted, folding forward, bent ect and of course it's support structure within the wing. :?

Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:23 am

Jack Cook wrote:
Likely the biggest delay they will experience in returning this one to the air will be getting a replacement prop.

I'd say I'll be the gear being twisted, folding forward, bent ect and of course it's support structure within the wing. :?


Spot on Jack.

Tearing the u/c pintle off the spar web is heavy but manageable if you don't clip a spar boom. The spar web is supposed to be frangible but the added complication here will be the modifications made for the extra fuel bowser wing mod.

Puzzling the the News video shows the aircraft close to the numbers. It either landed very short or very long. I am not sure which.

PeterA

shame

Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:30 am

That is a shame to see a nice airplane like that, but good that the pilot is safe. If anyone locally there obtains any details of the cause please post them. What is the background, of this plane, is that the one Dick Melton rebuilt as a two seater and was at Lakeland for awhile, or is it a later Harry Stenger built one? Whichever, good luck to the folks down there in getting her back in the air.

Re: shame

Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:40 am

Bill Greenwood wrote:That is a shame to see a nice airplane like that, but good that the pilot is safe. If anyone locally there obtains any details of the cause please post them. What is the background, of this plane, is that the one Dick Melton rebuilt as a two seater and was at Lakeland for awhile, or is it a later Harry Stenger built one? Whichever, good luck to the folks down there in getting her back in the air.


Bill,

This basically new Spitfire was initiated by Dick Melton, his second two seater, but was sold on and completed by Harry Stenger.

PeterA

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:01 pm

First: Very glad the personnel are OK.

Second: That news reporter deserves some kind of award for the following direct quote from an eyewitness:
_________________

Mac McCarthy, a plane enthusiast who lives at Hood Aerodrome, was outside on his deck when the plane crashed.

"It's right in front of my house. I didn't see it but I actually heard it. I was talking to someone and we heard an almighty bang and there it was."

He also lamented the destruction of the plane. "It's a Spitfire, man, and there's not many of them flying, eh. It's a crying shame, it's a beautiful aircraft."
_________________

PeterA, I would like to propose you change your signature line to the following:

It's a Spitfire, man, and there's not many of them flying, eh.

Comedy friggin' gold... are we sure this didn't happen in Canada? :D

Lynn

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:05 pm

OK...I'm gonna show my ignorance here. I didn't know that Spits (or any warbird for that matter) still used wooden props.

Mudge the igrant :hide:

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:08 pm

gary1954 wrote:
RyanShort1 wrote:Looks like the prop's totally toasted. Also that landing gear doesn't look good.

Ryan


Man talk about ground down
Image
Doug Brooker walked away unhurt after after his Spitfire crash landed at Masterton Aerodrome. Photo Wairarapa Times-Age


Gary,
It is a wood prop, it is not ground down, it is now splinters

wood

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:22 pm

Mudge, if wood was good enough for God to make trees out of, then it is good enough for R J Mitchell and Dowty Rotol to make Spitfire props out of. They are a spruce, I think, laminate and quite a work of art. I like the wood prop better than the metal ones that I have flown in a Spit as well as a P-51. The wood prop has less mass so accelerates and decelerates faster. Some of the Mustang props are smooth in cruise, but the wood prop can be also when properly balanced. And the wood blades have an interesting shape, halfway between a curve and a point, take a close look next time you see one.

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:32 pm

Cool...I learned something today. I can take the rest of the day off. :roll:

Mudge the educable :D

know

Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:43 pm

Hey Mudge, no charge for that info. Lot's more to tell, but no sooner do I find something of interest to relate than the weny whiners come on and complain that all those words are scaring them.

You might not have noticed the wood grain in Spitfire blades since it is covered with sort of an epoxy coating called Jablo, and then painted over that. It also has brass leading edges. Also the blades from Dowty have numbers on them of degrees and minutes. This refers to the angle the blade should be set in the hub to make it be aerodynamically the same and pull the same as the other blades in the set. I think I have this correct,Peter may know more.

There are several elements involved it the balance of the wood props. If one blade is not tracking true, if it is not following the same path as the others it can be rough. Then if you have them all in the same track, and set in the hub at the proper degrees to customize the pull of each blade the same, then comes the normal balance of the rotating mass or weight of each blade done by a strobe light and dynamic balance analyzer. Nothing better than a smooth Merlin.
Last edited by Bill Greenwood on Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:12 pm

is anyone currently making the wood blades?

Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:34 pm

brucev wrote:is anyone currently making the wood blades?


You'll like this.

For a good number of years now all Spitfire blades have all been made in Germany by Hoffman. :)

PeterA

Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:40 pm

mrhenniger wrote:
JDK wrote:The pic in the Herald shows a wheel forward of the wing - to get there the aircraft's got to have turned on the ground with the undercarriage lowered (collapsing it fwd). Not good for the attachment points, so more than panel damage and a prop.


I am not a mechanic or aircraft engineer so take this with a grain of salt. A few years ago when the Vintage Wings Spitfire suffered a prop strike at Geneseo there was concern about engine damage as well. As it turns out there was no damage to the engine. The prop itself had dissipated the energy in is destruction. Vintage Wings learned at the time that the drive system to the prop has a weak point designed into it so that the prop will shear away if before any damage to the engine will be done. Again I am not a mechanic, so my understanding of the design and damage dynamics may be off. I suspect in the picture of the NZ Spit the damage is to the prop and mounts (obviously) and underside metal/paint. Likely the biggest delay they will experience in returning this one to the air will be getting a replacement prop.

Mike

Although this sounds great I don't think so.
These prop blades are designed to absorb brutal forces and not fail. Running into the ground isn't one of them.
Even with a wood blade the engine is subject to a ground strike inspection.
There are also inspections on parts that are known to have failed in the past in the MLG systems. The pintle or trunion the gear pivots on, the studs that bolt the trunion to the wing and an fork that holds the down lock pin are among those parts known to fail. Any could have caused this type of accident or have failed during any kind of load. Judging from really a lack of damage this looks like a slow speed event, maybe even while turning on the runway something broke.
Rich

Re: NZ...Spitfire landing accident (Today 15 Jan '09) Crew O

Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:13 pm

hairy wrote:Breaking news, two seat Spitfire MH367 ZK-WDQ suffered an accident today at Masterton Airport while preparing for this weekends "Wings over Wairarapa" airshow.

All involved are okay, this is a breaking story so details are a bit sketchy, it has either overrun the runway or has bellied in gear up, more info as it develops.

Seen here at the NZ Warbirds open day 7 Dec. '08.
Image

The best place for info is probably here.............
http://rnzaf.proboards43.com/index.cgi? ... hread=8327

:(


Thanks Hairy, I snagged your picture for the write-up in Warbirds-Online, hope thats okay?

Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:08 pm

PeterA wrote:
brucev wrote:is anyone currently making the wood blades?


You'll like this.

For a good number of years now all Spitfire blades have all been made in Germany by Hoffman. :)

PeterA


What is the difference in price between the 4 blade and 5 blade ones? How much for each?
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