SWAMP GHOST

Jungle Rose · **Joined:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:01 am **Posts:** 8

For the politically correct, RACE = AMERICANS, honestly boys get a life

What has occurred here is one of the greatest recoveries in preservation history. Not only for the historical content but in the defeat of the insane philosphy of leaving wrecks where they are. Governments and institutions around the world have observed this process and now that the good guys have won, realise that possesion does not equal conservation.

And for the curious, Jungle Rose does not share the same bed as Jungle Bob since he was caught partying too hard with a bunch of native girls a little while ago. But I am a huge enthusiast of recovery work and its so nice to be a rose that will be a thorn in the side of those that promote the destruction of history by leaving it to rot.

RyanShort1 · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:20 pm

Jungle Rose,

Nice comeback. Welcome to the board.

So, if you're involved in the operations, am I right in being of the opinion that the old "Col. Rohr" was essentially correct in his predictions on where the aircraft is headed, and that it's intended to be a flyer?

Ryan

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:28 pm

Ryan

Oh god we can only hope. That B-17 would be an awesome aircraft to restore to fly. I think that's the best thing for her.

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:05 pm

I am not sure if I want to see her as a flyer or not yet. Either way is better than sitting in a swamp. The people that made this happen should be proud, including those in PNG. I want to see it preserved in the best condition possible. There is actual combat damage on this airframe and that should not be lost. Just as the Belle is being restored, but the patches and holes from flack and fighters are being preserved as they are very important. Also there is only one E model on static while there are two other E models in the works to fly, so this comes down to whatever is best for the plane. Either way, I'm just happy we can have that debate rather than one about getting it out of the swamp.

RMAllnutt · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:32 pm

Warbird Kid wrote:

Ryan

Oh god we can only hope. That B-17 would be an awesome aircraft to restore to fly. I think that's the best thing for her.

I couldn't disagree more. It would be lovely to see her fly, no question, but you'd have to replace the bulk of the skin, and much of the structure to do it safely... While this is fine with a beaten up wreck, I don't think it is when you have an aircraft which is as straight and intact as the Ghost. She's such a rarety. Her history lies in her structure. If they go ahead and replace all of that, what are you left with??? A very nice replica. They may as well have left her in the swamp if that's the case.

Ultimately, of course, it's Mr.Hagen's decision and I will be happy with whatever he chooses. He and his crew are to be much applauded for their endeavors.

Cheers,
Richard

SPANNERmkV · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:33 pm

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:42 pm

RMAllnutt wrote:

Warbird Kid wrote:

Ryan

Oh god we can only hope. That B-17 would be an awesome aircraft to restore to fly. I think that's the best thing for her.

I couldn't disagree more. It would be lovely to see her fly, no question, but you'd have to replace the bulk of the skin, and much of the structure to do it safely... While this is fine with a beaten up wreck, I don't think it is when you have an aircraft which is as straight and intact as the Ghost. She's such a rarety. Her history lies in her structure. If they go ahead and replace all of that, what are you left with??? A very nice replica. They may as well have left her in the swamp if that's the case.

Ultimately, of course, it's Mr.Hagen's decision and I will be happy with whatever he chooses. He and his crew are to be much applauded for their endeavors.

Cheers,
Richard

On the other side of things, I do hope that this aircraft's history is retained and preserved. Were now getting into a time frame where restoration is the second priority next to preservation. And that is a good thing. Heck, its better than good its GREAT! But I'd hate to see the Ghost displayed in a diorama display of the marsh she sat in for decades.

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 4:48 pm

I agree with you on that point Chris. I would like to see her rebuilt to a point to atleast be on her gear. But at this point we really have no idea what the crew that is going to restore/preserve her are facing. There may be unseen amounts of corrosion and damage in the aircraft. Like I said, I would rather be ahving this debate rather than the other ones.

K5DH · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 5:15 pm

Most of the time, when someone says, "That ship has sailed", they mean that an opportunity has been missed. In this case, however, it means, "YEE-HAW!!!"

I agree with the previously-posted opinions that restoring Swamp Ghost to flying condition would require so much work that she would end up retaining very little of her original self. Instead, I think it would be fantastic to see Swamp Ghost displayed in an indoor, climate-controlled museum in a diorama that accurately depicts how she was found in the swamps of PNG. It would have to be done using fake trees and fake water, of course, but with plenty of good lighting to enhance photography. An elevated viewing platform would be great, too. Another option would be to restore her to look the way she did on the day she bellied into the swamp, along with displayed photos of how she looked when recovered.

There is precendent for this general type of display. Planes of Fame has the wreckage of a Japanese WW2 bomber displayed that way, and I found their display to be fascinating to look at and very tasteful. Other museums have wreckage on display in its original form.

Flame away. You guys don't scare me. . . :lol:

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 5:33 pm

k5dh wrote:

Planes of Fame has the wreckage of a Japanese WW2 bomber displayed that way, and I found their display to be fascinating to look at and very tasteful. Other museums have wreckage on display in its original form.

This seems to be a popular trend to showcase certain aircraft. Especially ones of sufficient importance:

Halifax in Britain
Betty at POF
Zero at FoF
P-40 in Greece
Lake Murray B-25

And of course I understand the reasoning behind this. Either to try and put the viewer in that mindset of just uncovering a lost wreckage in the wild, or trying to display/preserve the plane in a "just as found" condition. But I have to say that if I had a choice, at least with the Betty, how many of you wouldn't want to see the POF take that project on and see that bomber restored back to flying condition with its original powerplants? As apposed to sitting in the corner of the hangar?

Maybe it truly is a better solution to Swamp Ghost to display her then fly her. But more people I'm sure would appreciate her if she rumbled into the local airport rather than sitting in a facsimile of her swamp. I guess I sway more towards the fly em' than stuff em' mentality. I mean if this aircraft was recovered in the 70's Im pretty sure the decision would have been unanimous to get her back in the air.

RyanShort1 · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 5:41 pm

For some interesting reading for all, and background for the new guys look here:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3739
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2486&p=20299&hilit=+swamp+ghost#p20299
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2451
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7309&hilit=+swamp+ghost
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6211&hilit=+swamp+ghost

Just food for thought. I think one of those threads included a possible destination.

Ryan

SPANNERmkV · **Posted:** Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:41 pm

... Reply removed by author

Dave Homewood · **Posted:** Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:24 am

It is good to see the dispute has been solved.

Hopefully the Somali pirates won't intercept it on the water.

wwrw2007 · **Posted:** Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:10 am

Warbird Kid wrote:

This seems to be a popular trend to showcase certain aircraft. Especially ones of sufficient importance:

Halifax in Britain
Betty at POF
Zero at FoF
P-40 in Greece
Lake Murray B-25

And of course I understand the reasoning behind this. Either to try and put the viewer in that mindset of just uncovering a lost wreckage in the wild, or trying to display/preserve the plane in a "just as found" condition. But I have to say that if I had a choice, at least with the Betty, how many of you wouldn't want to see the POF take that project on and see that bomber restored back to flying condition with its original powerplants? As apposed to sitting in the corner of the hangar?

Maybe it truly is a better solution to Swamp Ghost to display her then fly her. But more people I'm sure would appreciate her if she rumbled into the local airport rather than sitting in a facsimile of her swamp. I guess I sway more towards the fly em' than stuff em' mentality. I mean if this aircraft was recovered in the 70's Im pretty sure the decision would have been unanimous to get her back in the air.

Now isn't My Gal Sal going to be displayed as a wreck? That being the case we already will have a B-17 displayed as a wreck.

mustangdriver · **Posted:** Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:18 am

Yeah it has been restored and is going to be displayed in a belly landed diorama. The restoration is very complete. I say restore swamp ghost to as close to orignial as possible, preserving rather than restoring everything that can be. If what you can do allows for it to be static nly, then so be it. If it can fly, then great. I don't want to see a lot of history thrown out so that it can be flown.

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