Warbird Acquistions and Negotiation Secrecy

p51 · **Posted:** Wed Dec 17, 2014 3:31 pm

jtramo wrote:

The auction madness has pretty much destroyed the muscle car scene.

The general concept rippled into other car types as well. Military vehicles from WW2 have really gone up, in part of them now getitng into these high-end auctions (I heard of a unremarkable M-38A1 Jeep going for more than $40K 2 years ago, an insane amount even for a perfect restoration) and the European market going through the roof. There are now English and EU buyers combing military vehicle events in the US, looking for good deals on Jeeps and trucks from WW2. I've had two try to buy my Willys MB in three occasions.

51fixer · **Posted:** Thu Dec 18, 2014 12:33 pm

k5083 wrote:

JohnB wrote:

I wonder if we'll see the day when there is an aircraft equivalent of the big-time classic auto auctions?

That was tried in the 1990s at Santa Monica by David Price.

They had a few pretty good years, judging by the write-ups of the sales. I went to some of the public viewing days. They had some nice stuff.

August

That might have been the 1st time something other than a P-51 sold for more money than a P-51.

k5083 · **Posted:** Thu Dec 18, 2014 12:55 pm

51fixer wrote:

k5083 wrote:

JohnB wrote:

I wonder if we'll see the day when there is an aircraft equivalent of the big-time classic auto auctions?

That was tried in the 1990s at Santa Monica by David Price.

They had a few pretty good years, judging by the write-ups of the sales. I went to some of the public viewing days. They had some nice stuff.

August

That might have been the 1st time something other than a P-51 sold for more money than a P-51.

Right, that P-38 sale got a lot of attention at the time.

It's an example of what auctions and public disclosure of items for sale generally do, which is drive up prices. Buyers normally want quiet sales, sellers want to get the word out.

August

Speedy · **Posted:** Thu Dec 18, 2014 9:04 pm

I think I remember the Santa Monica auctions more for what they had up for bidding, not necessarily for what was actually sold or for how much. As I recall, a lot of the stuff that was quite cool never actually reached the reserve bid price (and there were some deals to be had out there) and a lot of the big-ticket items (like the P-38, the B-17, etc.) were made in private sales 'after' the auction was over.

But it it was impressive...especially the first one in 1990 or so.

Jerry O'Neill · **Posted:** Sat Dec 20, 2014 11:29 am

cooper9411 wrote:

Not just secrecy around aircraft sales but recoveries as well! Seen it happen many times where someone does all the "legwork" then at the last minute someone else slips in and snatches it out from underneath them! I know this thread is about aircraft sales but just thought I'd input my .02 about search and recoveries. OK I'm done for now! :drink3:

This is a major reason for keeping things quiet. Everybody enjoys knowing about a deal a friend is working to recover a hidden bird, but Ive seen this happen in the past and no matter how innocent a mention of a possible recovery may be, if the wrong person hears about it, then the project could be scooped up by someone offering more dollars at the last minute. I've known several recoveries in the past, be it aircraft, military vehicles or cars, that have slipped through friend's fingers because someone found out.

Sometimes being in "the loop" is being able to keep your trusty mouth shut!

Jerry

Human Factor · **Posted:** Sat Dec 20, 2014 1:18 pm

There is also a market rate for everything.

If you happen to make an acquisition at a price significantly different to that rate for something with relative rarity, you may not want to publicise it as that could have a detrimental effect on the very market rate you're trying to be significantly different to. :wink:

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