FAS Cavalier 404 & FAH 609 duel July '69
Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:38 pm
FAS P-51 Cavalier vs FAH F4U Corsair duel c. July 1969!
For many years & before Randy comes out with his P-51 book it was noted in many Forums why the FAS P-51 of Capt. Varela did not jettison his munitions load at the time of the engagement with FAH 609! c. July 17, 1969!
Drew came up with the answers by showing the armor seat of the FAS 217 FG-1D. Their Cavalier samples (6) arrived fm S. Florida Sept '68 w/o armored pilot seats. When the mercenary pilots arrived on or about 18 July 1969 at Ilopango to fly the surviving Cavalier samples (3) it was noted via request to the FAS CC.. that the P-51 Cavaliers should have an armored seat installed.
When Capt Varela (RIP) flying (FAS 404) was hit by surprise from the 6:00 position by FAH 609 it was already flying at a low altitude.Wounded in the neck area, his 1st survival instinct was not to fly his aircraft but to abandon it. "The last time I saw him, Lt. Col Fernando Soto Enriquez said in his interview c. Oct 2005.. he was trying to get out the cockpit to bail out." he was to low & his parachute did not fully open." The whole event had nothing to do with a seasoned pilot "forgetting'" to jettison his munitions... & the rest is now history. FAS conducted their own autopsy years later.
It will be interesting to see what kind of armored seats the FAS Cavaliers had when they arrived to the U.S c. 1974!! Perhaps Randy knows!
Pictured below is a close-up of the armored seat of the CT FG-1D the X FAS 217! Photo Drew via CT Museum.
Last edited by zorro9 on Mon Dec 29, 2014 1:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: FAS Cavalier 404 & FAH 609 duel July '69
Thu Dec 25, 2014 7:15 pm
p.s..... further more:
Whether the FAS Cavaliers samples flew with/without the famous wingtip tanks on 17 Jul '69 is irrelevant. It had to do something more with pilot proficiency & Hrs flown in a particular aircraft! The rest is pretty much history.
Whether the FAS Cavaliers samples flew with/without the famous wingtip tanks on 17 Jul '69 is irrelevant. It had to do something more with pilot proficiency & Hrs flown in a particular aircraft! The rest is pretty much history.
Re: FAS Cavalier 404 & FAH 609 duel July '69
Sun Dec 28, 2014 8:17 am
Carlos Planas (zorro9):
Definitively, you have not read Col. Francisco Zepeda Andino’s written account on this matter, published in Diario La Tribuna fourteen years or so ago; or Lt. Col. Fernando Soto Henríquez’ account on the events that took place on July 17, 1969, published in Diario La Tribuna on June 23, 2007.
So, please keep historical facts as they actually happened and leave misleading personal assumptions, theories, beliefs and/or interpretations aside. Guesswork, controversy and speculation are of nobody’s interest or benefit.
You mention that:
1) (Cavalier FAS 404) “was hit by surprise from the 6:00 position by FAH 609 it was already flying at a low altitude”.
Wrong! In short, this is what happened that day: three F4U-5 Corsairs flown by Captains Fernando Soto (609), Francisco Zepeda (604), and Edgardo Acosta (unk) were on a bombing and strafing mission at El Amatillo sector, during which, Captain Zepeda’s cannons jammed and withdrew a couple of miles to the southeast. As he was circling the area at about four thousand feet, he was ‘jumped’ by two Mustangs flown by Captain Varela (404) and Major Lovo (unk), and radioed for help. Immediately, Captain Soto and his wingman, Captain Acosta sped to his aid; after spotting the Mustang nearest Captain Zepeda, Captain Soto opened fire, ‘head-on’, at a distance he knew would not hit the enemy aircraft. At that moment, the second Mustang fled to nearby Salvadoran territory, while Captain Varela’s Mustang immediately made a split ‘S’ maneuver with Captain Soto’s Corsair now positioned behind its tail and after three or four bursts of canon fire, fragments from the fuselage and wings ripped apart from the Mustang which began to smoke. At about fifteen hundred feet, the Mustang dove to the ground on fire, and the pilot was seen attempting to jump the doomed aircraft.
2) (Captain Varela): “Wounded in the neck area …”
Wrong! Captain Varela’s body was examined by Doctor Juan Roberto Villalobos Castillo some one hundred plus meters from where the Mustang crashed, still entangled in the parachute’s suspension lines and partially deployed canopy. The pilot had hit the ground in a head-down position which resulted in a massive spinal cord injury to say the least. No injuries caused by gunfire were found. And surely, at least one photo was taken at the spot.
3) (Captain Varela): “The whole event had nothing to do with a seasoned pilot "forgetting'" to jettison his munitions...”
It is uncertain if Cap. Lovo was carrying any bombs, but fact of the matter is that at least Captain Varela did not jettison his bomb load at the precise moment they decided to attack Captain Zepeda’s Corsair, and that – most may agree – would have been the proper moment to release the two 250-lb bombs which were found near the Mustang’s wreckage.
But I am in no position to construe about Captain Varelas’s actions that day, or whether he was a “seasoned” pilot or not, and in any case, the reason why he did not release his bombs prior to engaging the enemy.
And, yes! the rest is pretty much history, but let's keep it as it really was.
Amado Aguiluz F.
http://s1258.photobucket.com/user/AAF19 ... g.html?o=0
Definitively, you have not read Col. Francisco Zepeda Andino’s written account on this matter, published in Diario La Tribuna fourteen years or so ago; or Lt. Col. Fernando Soto Henríquez’ account on the events that took place on July 17, 1969, published in Diario La Tribuna on June 23, 2007.
So, please keep historical facts as they actually happened and leave misleading personal assumptions, theories, beliefs and/or interpretations aside. Guesswork, controversy and speculation are of nobody’s interest or benefit.
You mention that:
1) (Cavalier FAS 404) “was hit by surprise from the 6:00 position by FAH 609 it was already flying at a low altitude”.
Wrong! In short, this is what happened that day: three F4U-5 Corsairs flown by Captains Fernando Soto (609), Francisco Zepeda (604), and Edgardo Acosta (unk) were on a bombing and strafing mission at El Amatillo sector, during which, Captain Zepeda’s cannons jammed and withdrew a couple of miles to the southeast. As he was circling the area at about four thousand feet, he was ‘jumped’ by two Mustangs flown by Captain Varela (404) and Major Lovo (unk), and radioed for help. Immediately, Captain Soto and his wingman, Captain Acosta sped to his aid; after spotting the Mustang nearest Captain Zepeda, Captain Soto opened fire, ‘head-on’, at a distance he knew would not hit the enemy aircraft. At that moment, the second Mustang fled to nearby Salvadoran territory, while Captain Varela’s Mustang immediately made a split ‘S’ maneuver with Captain Soto’s Corsair now positioned behind its tail and after three or four bursts of canon fire, fragments from the fuselage and wings ripped apart from the Mustang which began to smoke. At about fifteen hundred feet, the Mustang dove to the ground on fire, and the pilot was seen attempting to jump the doomed aircraft.
2) (Captain Varela): “Wounded in the neck area …”
Wrong! Captain Varela’s body was examined by Doctor Juan Roberto Villalobos Castillo some one hundred plus meters from where the Mustang crashed, still entangled in the parachute’s suspension lines and partially deployed canopy. The pilot had hit the ground in a head-down position which resulted in a massive spinal cord injury to say the least. No injuries caused by gunfire were found. And surely, at least one photo was taken at the spot.
3) (Captain Varela): “The whole event had nothing to do with a seasoned pilot "forgetting'" to jettison his munitions...”
It is uncertain if Cap. Lovo was carrying any bombs, but fact of the matter is that at least Captain Varela did not jettison his bomb load at the precise moment they decided to attack Captain Zepeda’s Corsair, and that – most may agree – would have been the proper moment to release the two 250-lb bombs which were found near the Mustang’s wreckage.
But I am in no position to construe about Captain Varelas’s actions that day, or whether he was a “seasoned” pilot or not, and in any case, the reason why he did not release his bombs prior to engaging the enemy.
And, yes! the rest is pretty much history, but let's keep it as it really was.
Amado Aguiluz F.
http://s1258.photobucket.com/user/AAF19 ... g.html?o=0
Re: FAS Cavalier 404 & FAH 609 duel July '69
Sun Dec 28, 2014 8:35 pm
Thank you, Amado, I could'nt agree more with the info, excellent.
Marco
Marco
Re: FAS Cavalier 404 & FAH 609 duel July '69
Mon Dec 29, 2014 7:55 pm
Hear, hear!!!
Enough already of this going against historical facts and the manipulation of well known information for obscure purposes.
Enough of posting photoshopped images that prove absolutely nothing.
High time for that individual to go back and keep on taking his prescribed medications.
Saludos,
Tulio
Enough already of this going against historical facts and the manipulation of well known information for obscure purposes.
Enough of posting photoshopped images that prove absolutely nothing.
High time for that individual to go back and keep on taking his prescribed medications.
Saludos,
Tulio