F2H-3 126358 and a PB4Y(?) - what's going on here??

[Chris Brame]

Looking through the SDASM archives, I found this odd photo:

It's in their aircraft accidents set, but this looks like no accident. Info from Forgotten Jets:

F2H-3 (F-2C) b/n 126358
*1953: VF-193 as "B-308".
*1956: VF-193 as “B-308”.

Anyone know what this setup was for? And besides the PB4Y, is that a Martin Mariner on the left?
Over to you...

[4RG.I.'S]

Based only on the pic, it looks very similar to the aircraft as they are being reclaimed in Davis Monthan. The wooden structures are used to securely and safely hold them up while main components are removed.

[Jesse C.]

Almost looks like North Island from what I can see in the background

[Malo83]

Almost looks like North Island from what I can see in the background

Point Loma ?

[airnutz]

I don't recall large clumps of trees on North Island and Point Loma was barely large enough for a SubGru 5 and a Coastie pier. If your talking PL as a reference on the North Island side of the channel, it was a bare ramp where the P5M's used to be stored.

[Nathan]

Love the F2H shot. Very interesting and very interesting weathering. The F2H is such a forgotten cold war warrior.

[sandiego89]

Looking through the SDASM archives, I found this odd photo:
And besides the PB4Y, is that a Martin Mariner on the left?
Over to you...

I opine CONVAIR Tradewind on the left (minus vertical stablizer). This would likely put the picture at NAS North Island or NAS Alameda.

[Taigh Ramey]

My bet is an instructional setting at a military school of some sort.

[mexchiwa]

Sure that's a Tradewind and not just an Albatross?

[maxum96]

I lived in San Diego for 35 years and spent a lot of time on North Island. That picture does not resemble North Island or anywhere around it to me.

[Nathan]

Looks like Alameda to me. Sometimes you have to look deeper. This F2H has VF-193 markings on it, which converted from Corsair to F2H onboard the USS Oriskany in 1953. The Oriskany was in and out of San Fransisco bay throughout the 1950's. Makes sense to me that the F2H might be seen at Alameda NAS. The F2H's were replaced by F3H's in 1957. I'd imagine this photo was taken sometime after 1957. (Unless this airframe was left behind at an earlier time as a spare parts source).

VF-193 deployed on USS Yorktown in 1958 as well. 1958 was a year after the F2H's would have been replaced. So obviously when VF-193 moved from Oriskany to Yorktown they switched aircraft during the change. Again Yorktown operated out of Alameda in the mid to late 1950's as well.


From Wiki:

Oriskany arrived at Yokosuka on 2 April 1955, and operated with the Fast Carrier Task Force ranging from Japan and Okinawa to the Philippines. This deployment ended on 7 September, and the carrier arrived at NAS Alameda, California, on 21 September.

She cruised the California Coast while qualifying pilots of Air Group 9, then put to sea from Alameda on 11 February 1956 for another rigorous Western Pacific (WestPac) deployment.

1957–1968[edit]





Oriskany showing angled flight deck and hurricane bow.
Oriskany returned to San Francisco on 13 August 1956, and entered the shipyard to undergo the SCB-125A modernization program on 1 October. She was decommissioned there on 2 January 1957. Oriskany received a new angled flight deck, aft deck edge elevator, enlarged forward elevator, and enclosed hurricane bow. Powerful new steam catapults replaced the older hydraulic catapults. The wooden flight deck planking was also replaced with aluminum planking.

Oriskany was recommissioned at the San Francisco Naval Shipyard on 7 March 1959, Captain James Mahan Wright was in command. Four days later she departed for shakedown out of San Diego with Carrier Air Group 14 embarked. Operations along the West Coast continued until 14 May 1960, when she again deployed to WestPac, returning to San Diego on 15 December. She entered San Francisco Naval Shipyard on 30 March 1961, for a five-month overhaul that included the first aircraft carrier installation of the Naval Tactical Data System

Go to the VF-193 wiki page (VF-194 now). It shows the flight deck of USS Oriskany and you can see F2H #308 in the background:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VF-142

[sandiego89]

Sure that's a Tradewind and not just an Albatross?

Good catch, could indeed be a Albatross, and seems to match this scheme:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... 13-12.jpg-

but the Tradewind is pretty similiar in this part of the hull.

As per my above I still think North Island or Alameda. For those folks like airnutz commenting about the North Side of North Island, yes your are indeed correct- the terrain across the bay from the seaplane ramps and large hangars would be more flat (Lindburgh Field), so no hills and trees. But if your refer to the West side of North Island, which has been an aircraft boneyeard for decades, and if a picture was taken at this boneyard looking west there would indeed be trees and a hill in the background, just over the channel. Much depot work, and scrapping was done there, and it would not be out of the places to have various obsolete aircraft parked there. Lots of historical pictures of aircraft dumped on the west side right next to the channel. Google map the west side of North Island and you will see all sorts of airframes still dumped there.

Nathan makes a good case for Alameda, but the trees and hill are much further away from Alameda. Alameda NAS is very flat, and the only hills quite a distance. Still indeed a possibilty.

I lean towards the west side of North Island, with the hills and trees of Ballast Point/Point Loma in the background. Taken about here, or at the boneyard area a few hundered yards north, looking due west would put trees/hills of point loma behind:

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.6991755 ... a=!3m1!1e3

[Nathan]

Sure that's a Tradewind and not just an Albatross?

Good catch, could indeed be a Albatross, and seems to match this scheme:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... 13-12.jpg-

but the Tradewind is pretty similiar in this part of the hull.

As per my above I still think North Island or Alameda. For those folks like airnutz commenting about the North Side of North Island, yes your are indeed correct- the terrain across the bay from the seaplane ramps and large hangars would be more flat (Lindburgh Field), so no hills and trees. But if your refer to the West side of North Island, which has been an aircraft boneyeard for decades, and if a picture was taken at this boneyard looking west there would indeed be trees and a hill in the background, just over the channel. Much depot work, and scrapping was done there, and it would not be out of the places to have various obsolete aircraft parked there. Lots of historical pictures of aircraft dumped on the west side right next to the channel. Google map the west side of North Island and you will see all sorts of airframes still dumped there.

Nathan makes a good case for Alameda, but the trees and hill are much further away from Alameda. Alameda NAS is very flat, and the only hills quite a distance. Still indeed a possibilty.

I lean towards the west side of North Island, with the hills and trees of Ballast Point/Point Loma in the background. Taken about here, or at the boneyard area a few hundered yards north, looking due west would put trees/hills of point loma behind:

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.6991755 ... a=!3m1!1e3

My assumption was for the boneyard shot. I think the photos are of different locations. Also maybe its Oakland NAS. The first photo has lots of railing around the aircraft and in the background. Kinda reminds me someplace near a dock.