Warbird Information Exchange

Any body hear anything?

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

its turned into a complete farce!

I'm not one for wanting to start rumors. So please carry on with the attitude of: "I'll believe it when I see it"

That being said. I have heard from those in the "know", that the folks directly involved with Swamp Ghost's recovery are not concerned with what has been published in the papers and are very confident that Swamp Ghost will leaving PNG (all of Swamp Ghost) soon.

....grain of salt in full effect, but I wish the team the best of luck.

Shay
____________
Semper Fortis

The most amazing thing to me is that the NMUSAF didn't step in and say "Look it is ours, shut up!" The Navy Museum is worse abou tthat than the USAFM by a long shot. If a guy is dragging a Corsair out of a lake to restore it the Navy will play the It is ours card jsut to get it, even though this guy could have been going to give it a great home. While the NMUSAF doesn't do that as much, this is a case where they should have. Since when does the PNG own that aircraft?

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

Hi,

I had the chance to ask the higher ups at the museum if they though she would be released. Their reply was as soon as enough palms are greased she will come home. There are several airframes that they would like to recover but the politics of these regions are to wishy washy to invest the time and money only to end up in a sticky political mess with third world crooks that thrive on greed.

This is also a private adventure that has nothing to do with the Air Force so to expect them to get involved is a fantasy. Much like the Lady Be Good when you leave a wrecked a/c for over 60 years then because of a new found value or interest does not give you the power of authority to storm in and demand that it be returned. The days of loading up a ship load of WW2 a/c and hauling them back to the U.S. for a box of glass beads and a case of wiskey are long gone, as a matter of fact the current person behind Swamp Ghosts recovery are the same group that was responsible for alot of the current policys now in effect though out the world.

We all love and enjoy seeing the rare a/c that have survived the scrap man ,the elements, crashes, ect. that have been restored and put on display. It's do to the dedication and hard work of a handful of folks that any of them are left today. Ya its easy to sit behind a computer screen and make demands on how the fate of these rare birds should be handled but the reality of it is that with out a lot of work ,money, and sacrafice they would all fall to the scappers torch. So many in todays society would be more than happy to see them all beaten into plow shears but thankfully in the last 25 years the interest level has risen to the point were we are at with the standards of todays restorations.

My thought on the matter is if you are truely interested in seeing that every a/c that is in danger finds a home get off your fluffy chair, start fund raising, polish up your hammer and saw and get to work. When you've proved yourself the world is at your door step but please don't put down or question the decisions of others unless you can walk in their shoes.

Thanks Mike

_________________
IF YOU CAN FIND IT WE CAN FIX IT

Hey Mike, I think you might have misunderstood what I meant. What I meant is that the PNG should have no say so in it what so ever. It is not their aircraft. I am all for the people that are recovering it to keep it or do what ever they plan on it. I wanted the NMUSAF to get invloved only as far as to aid the team already there. I don't mean that the NMUSAF should have any further dealing with it. Other then helping the efforts already in place.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

While I do strongly believe that "Swamp Ghost" deserves to return home, and soon, I strongly disagree that PNG should have no say in what happens. It is an abandoned artifact, on their land, and has very significant historical relevance to PNG.

That being said, it does seem that most of the appropriate people (ie. landowners, national museum etc. ) had signed off on the deal and been properly compensated. It wasn't until the issue became nationalized by certain people, who'll remain nameless, that the government as a whole suddenly got very concerned with it. This was all for public show though, but sadly I am sure there are more than a few extra palms outstretched now. It is a shame that it ended up this way. You can't just go storming in like a big bully though and demand it. That is way too simplistic an attitude, and not one which will ever get you the results you wish for. How do you imagine we would react if another country tried to pull that sort of thing off in the US? This sort of thing takes diplomacy, time, and money. Be patient. She'll eventually come home.

Richard

I agree that the PNG government should have a say in the matter. No matter how the aircraft got there, at this point in time it sits inside the sovereign nation of PNG. I would LOVE for the PNG government to make arrangements with interested parties to allow the respectful recovery and restoration of such historic aircraft. PNG has innumberable treasures, many I'm sure that most of us have never seen or heard of. It is incredibly sad to me that many parts of the world still do business based on the "greasy palm" method, but those of us lucky enough to have been blessed to live in free, developed nations are in a poor position to criticize.

For reasons relating to respecting the centuries-old concept of national sovereignty, PNG's government should have a say in how artifacts inside her territory are dispersed. I think it would be in everyone's best interests, including PNG, for there to be a streamlined, legal and responsible process developed to allow recovery of airframes while simultaneously benefiting the people of PNG and respeting their territorial integrity.

That all being said, I do wish the Swamp Ghost folks well and will eagerly await her restoration and display in the U.S. I do think, however, that for the time being, the less said (and the fewer rumors started) the better for all involved until this situation reaches resolution.

kevin

The reason I say that about the PNG is that it is clear that they are not acting on the relics best interest. They don't care about it, until somone wants to talk money. Then it becomes an important item to their government.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

In my opinion they're not "Relics" if they have a price tag on them.

Shay
____________
Semper Fortis

Exactly my point

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

That's a bogus arguement. I agree that they are not looking after these aircraft properly, but they have neither the resources, nor the money to do so. I am sure that they would like to give these abilities to their museum, but they have more important things to worry about, like building schools, roads, hospitals etc..

In any event, using your logic, there are plenty of aircraft in similar states here in the US which could simply be grabbed because the owners can't afford to take care of them. Are you saying that someone should just go in and take them because they aren't being looked after? That's not our call. They are a sovereign nation. The USAF abandoned these aircraft in place and relinquished ownership to the landowners/governments where they lay. Are you saying that we can simply renegue on that whenever we feel like it?

Using that logic, the state of Ohio, for example, could decide that they wanted all of the aircraft currently sitting in Walt Soplata's back garden. He obtained them fair and square, but has neither the resources, nor the money to maintain them. Yet, he sold a few aircraft when the price was right, or he needed the funds. It was perfectly within his right to do so, but no less so than PNG's rights. Just because, in this case, you don't agree with the situation on the ground doesn't give you the right to go in like a bull in a china shop and make demands like this. You need a more reasoned argument than "just because".

Richard

Walter Soplata does not want to sell his airplanes, and he also paid money for those airplanes. Now if a plane crashed in walter's backyard, I would say yes. IT IS NOT THIER AIRCRAFT. And once again, I will say that they PNG government is not upset that the aircraft is leaving, they are ticked that they diid not get their cut out of it. If it was that valued, they wouldn't have a price tag on it. I am nit sure why you want to give PNG so much credit, as the government is pretty corupt.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

Then using that logic, you're saying that Lex Cralley should give his Corsair back to the Navy? hmmmmm?

Shay
____________
Semper Fortis

We here in the US are so civilized; instead of alms for palms directly, we have a whole system of lobbying and govt contracts. Takes more alms for bigger palms!

_________________
Bill Greenwood
Spitfire N308WK