Aussie beaufighter off to USA

[sabredriver]

Seems the UK beaufighter under rebuild to fly i understand is off to the USA....

Shame the Oz govt couldnt find $1m to return this to oz as a rare warbird...

[Mark_Pilkington]

Australia already has 4 Beaufighters either on display or under restoration, and any or all of those would benefit from a share of $1M of Government/tax payers money to better preserve them.

The Government could also spend similar or less money to bring either the Camden or HARS aircraft into public ownership and static display at the AWM.

The price is likely to be much more than $1M to acquire it, and A19-144 is largely a composite airframe and therefore not of great heritage provenance.

While it would be nice to see it return to Australia I would much rather see it purchased, restored and traded with the USAFM to return the far more historically important A19-43 back to Australia for display in its own identity, and let this composite airframe sit in the USAFM in USAF colours.

Its twin A19-148 still remains in Australia spread between the HARS and RAAF Museum project kits, so a RAAF mark XI is alreadt assured of preservation in Australia.

With Two airworthy Beaufighter projects for sale from the UK, I dont think this a/c will sell too quickly, and sale to a US buyer is probably its best chance or returning to the skies for us all to enjoy as an Australian Government purchase into the AWM would only be for static display.

regards

Mark Pilkington

[JDK]

http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/p ... php?t=9998

http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/p ... php?t=9319

[Jungle Bob]

In response to Mark Pilkingtons posting I would correct the fact that HARS has any of "148" in its possesion. Everything Pommie went to the RAAF Museum and more.

The saga of the RAAF Museum acquiring the Beau would fill a small book. Despite making the purchase incredibly easy for them, they procrastinated and dilly dallied so much it was almost impossible to believe that these people were in charge of preserving our heritage.

We now hear that "148" is off to the Australian War Memorial in Canberra for restoration on a "shared arrangement. Needless to say the curatorial enthusiasm for the project is near zero. Apparently the veterans campaigning to have a Beau in the AWM finally got their way despite AWM management and staff being opposed to the project.

HARS proceed with their Beau rebuild which is restricted by current workshop space but due to move in the middle of the year to new facilities at the HARS Albion Park complex.

On a final note I must confess to being tired of reading incorrect information about the Beaufighters in Oz. The recent Flypast article was an abortion of incorrect facts and names.

[gregv]

Seems the UK beaufighter under rebuild to fly i understand is off to the USA....

Is there some new information out there, i.e. has the aircraft actually been sold? If so, is there any idea to whom and to what end?

This bird deserves to fly. With a pair of Hercules.


cheers

greg v.

[Mark_Pilkington]

Jungle Bob,

My comment regarding A19-148 being spread between the RAAF Museum and HARS project is obviously incorrect, and was a "fly away" comment rather than intended to be the main thrust of my post.

The article was the source/inspiration of my comment, although on re-reading the HARS a/c is identified there as being based on A19-144 rather than A19-148 which is with the RAAF Museum, rendering my comment incorrect against the article in any case.

The article identifies A19-144 as the basis of the Fighter Collection project as well as the HARS project and I think this is what caused me to state

"Its twin A19-148 still remains in Australia spread between the HARS and RAAF Museum project kits, so a RAAF mark XI is already assured of preservation in Australia."

Apologies if I had added to further mis-information.

gregv,

The current interest has been fueled by a news article in FlightPath an Australian magazine, that reports the fitting of the wings to the Beaufighter and quotes a quotes a source from Provenance Fighter Sales stating:

"this rare historic artefact has been offered for sale or trade with less significant axis aircraft types to, Federal, Military and Private Museums with in Australia, however it looks like the Beaufighter will be acquired by an American Organisation, which will make to former RAAF Beaufighters on display in that country."

It is unclear if this is simply lamenting the lack of Australian responses to purchase the aircraft, or flagging an impending sale in the US?

regards

Mark Pilkington

[gregv]

thanks Mark

would I be wrong in assuming that the "American Organisation" quoted is indeed Provenance Sales?

I am curious as to why Mr. Allen would not want to snap this one up, as it seems to (loosely) fit the FHC criteria. At any rate it did at least spend time in the combat zone.

cheers

greg v.

[Mark_Pilkington]

gregv,

the reference to an American Organisation is made in the article

"this rare historic artefact has been offered for sale or trade with less significant axis aircraft types to, Federal, Military and Private Museums with in Australia, however it looks like the Beaufighter will be acquired by an American Organisation, which will make to former RAAF Beaufighters on display in that country."

which is quoted as being stated by a source from Provenance Fighter Sales.

I think most people would view Mr Allen and FHC as the most likely and financially viable "American Organisation" to acquire the aircraft from Provenance who apparantly currently own it, despite it remaining in the UK at the Fighter Collection and continuing to be worked on by them.

All very complicated an confusing.

regards

Mark Pilkington

[Mark_Pilkington]

Jungle Bob,

further to in-accuracies on the identities of various Beaufighters, and my own blunder into that same arena, it would be great to see the HARS website pages regarding the Beaufighter project completed with pics etc and details of the airframe history, and perhaps document the end location of many of the airframes parts collected by HARS over the years.

Unfortunately the blank HARS "Beaufighter" webpage along with the apparantly incorrect details provided HARS website page "About the Society" adds further to the "identity" confusion at this time.

http://www.hars.org.au/about/index.html

It was in this capacity that our members virtually traversed the Australian continent from Tasmania to Kalumburu in North Western Australia and from cape Llewellin to Cape York in search of aviation artefacts. These expeditions resulted in providing considerable assistance to many restorations including many outside of the Society itself. Of significant importance was the recovery in the early eighties of two Beaufighter airframes from North Western Australia. One, a Mk1 Beaufighter Aircraft was exchanged after it had been restored by the Society for the Lockheed Super Constellation. This aircraft now resides in the United States Air Force Museum in Dayton, Ohio. The other airframe is central to the Mk21 Beaufighter currently under restoration by the Society.

Seemly referring to the Kalumburu recoveries being of a mark 1 (A19-43?) and a Mk 21 (A8-371?) rather than the two mk XI airframes A19-144? and A19-148? I always understood these airframes were largely centre-section and fuselage sections, without cockpits?

It would be great if the Beaufighter fact sheet when completed could tell of the recovery of A19-144 and A19-148 from Kalumburu and comment on their end destinations as well as describing the situation regarding A8-324, A8-374 and A19-43, and the collection of NOS items such as Centre-Sections and wings, HARS have played such a major role in the return of at least 5 additional Beaufighter survivors from the original 5 recorded as existing in collections through the 1970's etc. and should be proud of their contributions in this area.

In the absence of an authoritive reference there continues to be various suggestions of the fuselage of A8-374 being with the USAFM in addition to holding A19-43, (adding to confusion over the provenance of the fuselage sections used in the USAFM restoration) and the fuselage of A8-324 along with A19-144 being used in the restoration at the Fighter Collection, leaving some confusion as to which airframe is the basis of the HARS restoration. (which I assume is based on mk 21 A8-374??)

my own guesstimate or line of best fit, based on various replies and corrections in such forums would be:

A19-144 centre-section and fuselage with contributions from A8-324 fuselage is the basis the Fighter Collection? with the airframe being presented as A19-144?

A19-148 centre-section and fuselage is the basis of the RAAFM project?

A19-43 is largely itself? as recovered from Nhill, on display at USAFM.

A8-374? fuselage is the basis of the HARS mark 21 project with NOS centre-section and other sources? (ie little or no A19-144 involvement)

The Flightpath article also refers to the rear fuselage of A19-148? being used in the restoration of the Skyport mk1F X7688.

I know you always try resolve these confusions openly in forums such as these, but it might be easier to put it all on the HARS website, along with photos etc

regards

Mark Pilkington