Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:49 pm
Firstly to Phil K from a couple of pages back--amen on the mop-painted Invasion stripes--I'd kill to see someone do them accurately! I've seen several photos of the men applying the stripes with whatever was at hand.
Second, I've seen 927 in person and it is really looking good--there is still work to do, but everyone should be happy with the result.
Scott
Second, I've seen 927 in person and it is really looking good--there is still work to do, but everyone should be happy with the result.
Scott
Fri Mar 09, 2007 2:28 am
Gary,
Since I don't have another way of contacting you, I have to use this forum. Do you have any use for a quantity of 3/16 close clearance clecos? These are shorter than standard and made to get into smaller spaces. I bought several hundred at an auction a numbe of years ago and have been looking for a home for some of them. If you are interested, I will donate them to the squadron for your use. You can contact me at richardscarvie@msn.com. Just in case you think I am a newbie, I drive the tug at Airsho and we have met on many occasions.
RICK
Since I don't have another way of contacting you, I have to use this forum. Do you have any use for a quantity of 3/16 close clearance clecos? These are shorter than standard and made to get into smaller spaces. I bought several hundred at an auction a numbe of years ago and have been looking for a home for some of them. If you are interested, I will donate them to the squadron for your use. You can contact me at richardscarvie@msn.com. Just in case you think I am a newbie, I drive the tug at Airsho and we have met on many occasions.
RICK
Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:41 am
Not feelin' great this morning, so I'm getting a late start. Will try to address some of the questions and comments that popped up last night, real quickly, so I can get back to work...
John Cotter, thanks for your input on the thread here. I also want to thank you again for the hard work you put in during your visit.
George, to get the bomb doors & racks, I actually got the tip to talk to a guy named Van, who runs the following site... http://www.questmasters.us/B-24.html . He was very helpful and easy to deal with regarding the bomb doors and racks. We worked out a trade and he was wonderful to deal with. He's always looking for W.W.II aircraft parts and pieces, so if anyone out there knows any leads to that stuff, you should contact him.
T-6G Pilot, it's kind of funny that you ask that. I was just thinking yesterday that it'll be no time at all before someone asks about the paint on the static port, especially since I have the placard, "Static Port, Keep Clean." I will be leaving the paint on the static port, however, it is unhooked right now and the holes and the rest of the port have been cleaned of any residual paint. We are also installing new pitot tubes, so a full pitot/static test was going to be done upon completion anyway. Good question though.
BDK, as usual, that is a great tip with the stencils. On the bigger ones, I do tend to cheat a little like you've suggested. The smaller ones usually don't need it though. You've always got good suggestions and I appreciate you posting them here.
Second Air Force, Phil K, and everyone else, I've decided that I WILL go ahead and brush the letters on the airplane, like originally done. Some of the general public won't understand it, but I think that it's the right way to do it on this airplane.
B-17engineer, You betcha! We'd love more clecos. I will zap you an e-mail as soon as this post is posted. I appreciate the thought.
Gary
John Cotter, thanks for your input on the thread here. I also want to thank you again for the hard work you put in during your visit.
George, to get the bomb doors & racks, I actually got the tip to talk to a guy named Van, who runs the following site... http://www.questmasters.us/B-24.html . He was very helpful and easy to deal with regarding the bomb doors and racks. We worked out a trade and he was wonderful to deal with. He's always looking for W.W.II aircraft parts and pieces, so if anyone out there knows any leads to that stuff, you should contact him.
T-6G Pilot, it's kind of funny that you ask that. I was just thinking yesterday that it'll be no time at all before someone asks about the paint on the static port, especially since I have the placard, "Static Port, Keep Clean." I will be leaving the paint on the static port, however, it is unhooked right now and the holes and the rest of the port have been cleaned of any residual paint. We are also installing new pitot tubes, so a full pitot/static test was going to be done upon completion anyway. Good question though.
BDK, as usual, that is a great tip with the stencils. On the bigger ones, I do tend to cheat a little like you've suggested. The smaller ones usually don't need it though. You've always got good suggestions and I appreciate you posting them here.
Second Air Force, Phil K, and everyone else, I've decided that I WILL go ahead and brush the letters on the airplane, like originally done. Some of the general public won't understand it, but I think that it's the right way to do it on this airplane.
B-17engineer, You betcha! We'd love more clecos. I will zap you an e-mail as soon as this post is posted. I appreciate the thought.
Gary
Fri Mar 09, 2007 9:03 am
Want to know what $11,000.00 in exhaust repairs looks like?........
I'm very happy with the quality of work done, but I want to send a word of advice to other Warbird operators out there...
Don't just keep cobbling up your exhaust components over the years. If you start getting cracks in your exhaust (which you will), go ahead and weld them up. But when you start having repeated problems, don't just keep putting off sending it to a shop because "we don't have the time or money for that," because it will end up biting you in the rear. Get your exhaust repaired BEFORE you end up wasting more time and more money than you would have in the early stages of deterioration.
Aircraft Exhaust, Inc. did our repair work for us. I literally had to beg them to take on this project because the exit stacks were so deteriorated, they didn't even want to mess with them and felt bad about how expensive it was going to be to make the repairs. However, they were VERY good to deal with. I was fortunate that they put other jobs aside in order to accomodate our scheduling issues. Even with that, it took about three months to get the exhaust back. They also took a HUGE portion of the bill off and ate a bunch of the costs. Thank you Aircraft Exhaust, Inc.!
Moral of the story:
Don't neglect your systems on your airplane. Your airplane will tell you when it's not happy. Listen to it.
Gary
I'm very happy with the quality of work done, but I want to send a word of advice to other Warbird operators out there...
Don't just keep cobbling up your exhaust components over the years. If you start getting cracks in your exhaust (which you will), go ahead and weld them up. But when you start having repeated problems, don't just keep putting off sending it to a shop because "we don't have the time or money for that," because it will end up biting you in the rear. Get your exhaust repaired BEFORE you end up wasting more time and more money than you would have in the early stages of deterioration.
Aircraft Exhaust, Inc. did our repair work for us. I literally had to beg them to take on this project because the exit stacks were so deteriorated, they didn't even want to mess with them and felt bad about how expensive it was going to be to make the repairs. However, they were VERY good to deal with. I was fortunate that they put other jobs aside in order to accomodate our scheduling issues. Even with that, it took about three months to get the exhaust back. They also took a HUGE portion of the bill off and ate a bunch of the costs. Thank you Aircraft Exhaust, Inc.!
Moral of the story:
Don't neglect your systems on your airplane. Your airplane will tell you when it's not happy. Listen to it.
Gary
Fri Mar 09, 2007 9:49 am
Rick
Welcome to WIX.
Norm
Welcome to WIX.
Norm
Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:53 pm
Fri Mar 09, 2007 4:14 pm
Thanks Kevin, but the B-24A didn't have any of those fancy electric gun sights or even turrets. It was pretty much a high tech World War One gun system. I reckon that's why the only made about 37 or so of them. It got outdated pretty quick.
Thanks for the heads up though, it's greatly appreciated!
Gary
Thanks for the heads up though, it's greatly appreciated!
Gary
Data block
Sat Mar 10, 2007 2:45 am
Anyone else notice the data block?
"U. S. ARMY B-24A"
"SERIAL NO. AM927"
(not 40-2366!) Hmm... another hint about the paint scheme?
"U. S. ARMY B-24A"
"SERIAL NO. AM927"
(not 40-2366!) Hmm... another hint about the paint scheme?
Re: Data block
Sat Mar 10, 2007 4:31 am
Chris Brame wrote:Anyone else notice the data block?
"U. S. ARMY B-24A"
"SERIAL NO. AM927"
(not 40-2366!) Hmm... another hint about the paint scheme?
Nah, not another hint, just the way we've had to work this out with the tricky business of AM927's personality. 40-2366 WAS going to be the serial number of this airplane, and may have actually been (on paper) for a short period, but during the aircraft's building process, it became AM927. The whole serial number thing can definitely get confusing with this airplane. For that matter, there are actually quite a few little do-dads with this airplane that are a bit confusing.
It's been a tough decision as to how to represent certain things on Ol' 927, regarding paint, authenticity, etc. For example, this airplane actually did have the British roundels on it originally, but it was going to have the pre-War insignia on it, which is what I was told I would be putting on this new paint job. You must remember, although I often times have a pretty strong say in what does or doesn't get done with this project, I didn't get to choose everything that gets put on the airplane. We still have to make it "sellable", in order to gain and maintain the "general" public's interest, which unfortunately means everything won't necessarily be authentic.
Of course, one could certainly say that were going to present a more authentic version of this airplane than the old Diamond Lil scheme, right?
So there will be a mix of original, and not quite original on the paint scheme. Because the elected staff insisted on noseart (which I personally didn't want since this airplane never had it), and the name of the airplane is now "Ol' 927" (what it was actually affectionately called during the War), it just didn't seem right to put any other serial number on the airplane besides AM927. Know what I mean?
As far as keeping the paint scheme secret, it's not really a secret anymore. The noseart, however, will remain a secret until the unveiling. Oh, and by the way, after all of the different ideas for that art were submitted to the elected staff, it was a fellow WIXer's drawing that got voted as the new noseart for the airplane. So congratulations go out to that annonymous person, who's name I won't mention yet so that he (or she) won't get pressured by y'all for a sneak peak at his (or her) artwork.
And since we're speaking of paint, I should probably walk back out there and apply some more of it to the airplane. I'll holler at y'all later.
Gary
Sat Mar 10, 2007 7:57 am
Gary,
So your going for the Ferry Command camo setup? Interesting, are you going to have the Command insignia on the fusalage? Also, Im sure you have heard this from other people, but isn't the black supposed to be painted higher on the fusalage?
Anyways, your doing great work, I wish I wasnt on the other side of the world so I could come and help!
So your going for the Ferry Command camo setup? Interesting, are you going to have the Command insignia on the fusalage? Also, Im sure you have heard this from other people, but isn't the black supposed to be painted higher on the fusalage?
Anyways, your doing great work, I wish I wasnt on the other side of the world so I could come and help!
Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:22 am
Stratofortressflyer wrote:Gary,
So your going for the Ferry Command camo setup? Interesting, are you going to have the Command insignia on the fusalage? Also, Im sure you have heard this from other people, but isn't the black supposed to be painted higher on the fusalage?
Yeah, I never get tired of the second guessing.
Yes, the black went higher up on most of the B-24A's, but not all of them. When the suggestion was originally made to put black paint all the way up the side of the fuselage, that idea was voted off the island about as fast as the idea of the big American Flag on the side (rather than some unoriginal noseart). The black was going to be "too hot," according to the important people. The way I see it, when it's 120 degrees on a ramp somewhere in the middle of the summer, it's gonna be hot no matter what color the airplane is.
I don't know if I'm going to have time to paint the Ferry Command paint scheme on the side of the airplane or not. We still have a ton of work to do before I even worry about that. Fortunately, this weekend, we have a few good volunteers here that are doing a wonderful job for us. I'm personally running out of gas and don't know how much longer I'll be able to keep up the pace I've been maintaining since late October. I need more people helping and less people complaining right now (not directed at you Stratofortressflyer, just a comment in general).
Gary
Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:34 am
Those girls did a great job painting that thing.
Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:35 am
Gary,
I was just about to repost to telling you to ignore what I said before, I found a picture of the British paint scheme with the black low along the bottom. Its definately an interesting choice. As far as the black being painted higher up affecting how hot it is in the plane, belive me it doesnt make much difference, try sitting in a BUFF in the Loisiana heat waiting to take off and you will realize its going to get hot inside an airplane no matter what you do.
Anyways, Im never one to second guess you, Im just not there to ask you in person, which brings me to my second question. I have been looking at some B-24A pictures and I noticed a set of four windows up by the radio operators position and I saw that you have not drilled those out. I take it those are for a later date due to the deadline?
Marc
I was just about to repost to telling you to ignore what I said before, I found a picture of the British paint scheme with the black low along the bottom. Its definately an interesting choice. As far as the black being painted higher up affecting how hot it is in the plane, belive me it doesnt make much difference, try sitting in a BUFF in the Loisiana heat waiting to take off and you will realize its going to get hot inside an airplane no matter what you do.
Anyways, Im never one to second guess you, Im just not there to ask you in person, which brings me to my second question. I have been looking at some B-24A pictures and I noticed a set of four windows up by the radio operators position and I saw that you have not drilled those out. I take it those are for a later date due to the deadline?
Marc
Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:07 am
Oh, do you mean these windows that Dave Miller is installing right now?
We're trying hard to get this thing as far along as possible. But as you can see, without helpers, I would never be able to get this project done on my own. I suspect that all of the radio operator's windows, on both sides, will be finished and installed before the day is done tomorrow.
Gary
We're trying hard to get this thing as far along as possible. But as you can see, without helpers, I would never be able to get this project done on my own. I suspect that all of the radio operator's windows, on both sides, will be finished and installed before the day is done tomorrow.
Gary
Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:21 am
Gary:
You are running a marathon at a sprinters pace, keep up the good work.
We are all in your corner!
You are running a marathon at a sprinters pace, keep up the good work.
We are all in your corner!