Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:04 am
What Group Captain noizeedave says...25's & Jugs
Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:51 am
There's quite a lot of these a/c I've never seen close- up's of. Nose-art I've only read about or seen remnants of. Wonderful thread people, keep it coming.
T J
T J
Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:53 am
Stoney wrote:You're asking me to remember who flew what after 39 years? I can't remember what I had for breakfest:) I'll try!
Stoney;
Let me help with a few questions I have:
Were there days when you didn't fly while they shot the actors, meaning the B-25's were not needed?
What did you do in the down time?
In some of the mass takeoff scenes, can you tell which aircraft you are in?
Do you happen to know if the tail of Orr's B-25 seen floating in the water is the same one as they burned on the runway,or was it perhaps a different airframe section?
Have you ever been back to the set in Mexico?
Thanks.
Jerry
Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:54 am
Thank You Stoney & Jack for all the info, stories and pix. I haven't seen the movie again since about 7 months ago, will have to watch it once more soon.
This sort of thread is what this site is all about.
bill word
This sort of thread is what this site is all about.
bill word
Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:07 am
Stoney wrote:You're asking me to remember who flew what after 39 years? I can't remember what I had for breakfest:) I'll try!
Yes Stoney, we are...I too suffer from CRS, so you are not alone.
And did we ever determine what B-25 is lying on the ground in one of the scenes...looked to dismanteled to have been X-HEY to me
Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:55 am
AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAA found it!!! 
THE Controlled Crash Scene.
Also, in looking at the film at 3:50 of the 5:02 minute clip, the B-25 fuselage lying on the ground does not appear to be that of HEY, so, what B-25 fuselage is it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jYoeqUs2KI
THE Controlled Crash Scene.
Also, in looking at the film at 3:50 of the 5:02 minute clip, the B-25 fuselage lying on the ground does not appear to be that of HEY, so, what B-25 fuselage is it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jYoeqUs2KI
Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:59 am
Here's some Catch-22 Trivia courtesy of IMDB:
Jerry
Trivia for
Catch-22 (1970) More at IMDb Pro »
George C. Scott turned down the role of Colonel Cathcart, saying he had effectively played the same part in Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (1964).
While on a tirade in his office, Major Major walks past a framed photo of Franklin Delano Roosevelt. In a continuous shot, he paces around his office, and when he passes the picture again, it is of Winston Churchill, as he makes one more round of his office and grabs the fake mustache out of his filing cabinet, the photo has changed to that of Joseph Stalin.
Paul Simon was originally going to be in the film, but his role was written out.
Director Mike Nichols wanted 36 B-25's to create the big Army Air Force base, but the budget couldn't stretch to more than 17 flyable Mitchells. An additional non-flyable hulk was acquired in Mexico, made barely ferry-able and flown with landing gear down to location, only to be burned and destroyed in the landing crash scene. The wreck was then buried in the ground next to the runway, where it remains to this day.
The film has one of the longest, most complex uninterrupted scenes ever made. In the scene, where two actors talking against a background, 16 of the 17 planes, four groups of four aircraft, took off at the same time. As the scene progresses, the actors entered a building and the same planes were seen through the window, climbing into formation. The problem was, for every take, the production manager has to call the planes back and made to take off again for every take of the particular scene. This was done four times.
Second Unit Director John Jordan refused to wear a harness during a bomber scene. While giving a hand signal to another airplane from the tail gunner position in the camera plane, he lost his grip and fell 4 000 feet to his death.
Stacy Keach was originally cast as Colonel Cathcart when shooting started, but things did not work out, and Charles Grodin (I) (who had already been cast as Capt. Aarfy Aardvark) was asked to take over. As the part was written for an older man, old age make-up was experimented with for a few days, until it was decided to cast Martin Balsam instead, and Grodin returned to his original part.
This is the first American film to show an actor on the toilet - Martin Balsam, playing opposite 'Anthony Perkins'. Ten years earlier, the first American film to show a toilet was Psycho (1960)... starring Martin Balsam and 'Anthony Perkins'.
The film has no original musical score.
The actor who played the wounded airman had to share his costume with several pounds of offal that made it look as if his intestines had been exposed by the injury.
The Mexico location shooting took six months to complete because cinematographer 'David Watkin' would only film between 2pm to 3pm to get the same lighting.
Orson Welles tried to acquire the rights to the novel so that he could film it. He had to be content with playing the part of General Dreedle.
Since the filming of Catch-22 (1970) took longer than planned, Art Garfunkel wasn't able to make it back to New York in time to start writing and recording the Simon & Garfunkel album "Bridge Over Troubled Water". Angered by the delay, Paul Simon wrote the track "The Only Living Boy in New York" about the incident. The lyrics "Tom, get your plane right on time/I know your part'll go fine/Fly down to Mexico" were a thinly veiled attack aimed at Garfunkel (who was "Tom" of Simon & Garfunkel's earlier incarnation, Tom & Jerry) leaving Simon alone in New York to write the bulk of the album himself.
According to his book, "Kiss Me Like A Stranger", Gene Wilder was the original choice for Lt. Milo Minderbinder, but he turned the role down, citing creative differences, and instead accepted the dual role he plays in Start the Revolution Without Me (1970)
The squadron patch on Yossarian's leather A-2 flight jacket -- a female nude riding a descending bomb, hurling a bolt of lightning -- was the actual patch of Joseph Heller's 488th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), one of four B-25 squadrons (the others being the 486th, 487th, and 489th) in the 340th Bombardment Group (Medium) during World War II.
According to writer Nora Ephron in a March 16, 1969 New York Times article, Jack Lemmon had "originally wanted to play Yossarian" in a film version of Joseph Heller's book.
Jerry
Trivia for
Catch-22 (1970) More at IMDb Pro »
George C. Scott turned down the role of Colonel Cathcart, saying he had effectively played the same part in Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (1964).
While on a tirade in his office, Major Major walks past a framed photo of Franklin Delano Roosevelt. In a continuous shot, he paces around his office, and when he passes the picture again, it is of Winston Churchill, as he makes one more round of his office and grabs the fake mustache out of his filing cabinet, the photo has changed to that of Joseph Stalin.
Paul Simon was originally going to be in the film, but his role was written out.
Director Mike Nichols wanted 36 B-25's to create the big Army Air Force base, but the budget couldn't stretch to more than 17 flyable Mitchells. An additional non-flyable hulk was acquired in Mexico, made barely ferry-able and flown with landing gear down to location, only to be burned and destroyed in the landing crash scene. The wreck was then buried in the ground next to the runway, where it remains to this day.
The film has one of the longest, most complex uninterrupted scenes ever made. In the scene, where two actors talking against a background, 16 of the 17 planes, four groups of four aircraft, took off at the same time. As the scene progresses, the actors entered a building and the same planes were seen through the window, climbing into formation. The problem was, for every take, the production manager has to call the planes back and made to take off again for every take of the particular scene. This was done four times.
Second Unit Director John Jordan refused to wear a harness during a bomber scene. While giving a hand signal to another airplane from the tail gunner position in the camera plane, he lost his grip and fell 4 000 feet to his death.
Stacy Keach was originally cast as Colonel Cathcart when shooting started, but things did not work out, and Charles Grodin (I) (who had already been cast as Capt. Aarfy Aardvark) was asked to take over. As the part was written for an older man, old age make-up was experimented with for a few days, until it was decided to cast Martin Balsam instead, and Grodin returned to his original part.
This is the first American film to show an actor on the toilet - Martin Balsam, playing opposite 'Anthony Perkins'. Ten years earlier, the first American film to show a toilet was Psycho (1960)... starring Martin Balsam and 'Anthony Perkins'.
The film has no original musical score.
The actor who played the wounded airman had to share his costume with several pounds of offal that made it look as if his intestines had been exposed by the injury.
The Mexico location shooting took six months to complete because cinematographer 'David Watkin' would only film between 2pm to 3pm to get the same lighting.
Orson Welles tried to acquire the rights to the novel so that he could film it. He had to be content with playing the part of General Dreedle.
Since the filming of Catch-22 (1970) took longer than planned, Art Garfunkel wasn't able to make it back to New York in time to start writing and recording the Simon & Garfunkel album "Bridge Over Troubled Water". Angered by the delay, Paul Simon wrote the track "The Only Living Boy in New York" about the incident. The lyrics "Tom, get your plane right on time/I know your part'll go fine/Fly down to Mexico" were a thinly veiled attack aimed at Garfunkel (who was "Tom" of Simon & Garfunkel's earlier incarnation, Tom & Jerry) leaving Simon alone in New York to write the bulk of the album himself.
According to his book, "Kiss Me Like A Stranger", Gene Wilder was the original choice for Lt. Milo Minderbinder, but he turned the role down, citing creative differences, and instead accepted the dual role he plays in Start the Revolution Without Me (1970)
The squadron patch on Yossarian's leather A-2 flight jacket -- a female nude riding a descending bomb, hurling a bolt of lightning -- was the actual patch of Joseph Heller's 488th Bombardment Squadron (Medium), one of four B-25 squadrons (the others being the 486th, 487th, and 489th) in the 340th Bombardment Group (Medium) during World War II.
According to writer Nora Ephron in a March 16, 1969 New York Times article, Jack Lemmon had "originally wanted to play Yossarian" in a film version of Joseph Heller's book.
Tue Dec 02, 2008 12:05 pm
That is some cool information
Great Thread
Tue Dec 02, 2008 2:51 pm
Great Thread! You have to wonder, how many of those B-25s would have survived to the present day if not for the movie? Back in 1983, I vaguely remember stumbling around the Catch 22 Beach area trying to find the remains of the B-25 that was burned during filming. Some of the "old timers" in Tucson had told me it was still partly visible in the late 1970s. I never found it but I sure drank a few Pacifico Clara beers trying to locate it. Computer generated flying scenes have come a long way but they are still no match for the real thing! Thanks Stoney! Thanks for posting the images Jack. Very cool!
Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:33 pm
I was looking through the photos and tried to identify the different a/c from the codes, names, etc. I originally thought from different listings of the 25s that they kept their tail codes throughout filming. This would have made things easier. However that seems not to be the case. Does anyone know if they changed around on all a/c?
Here is the case I found. 6V on both 9451Z and 52Z.
N9452Z
N9451Z
Are the photos below showing the same a/c? Judging from the colors, polished props, white wall tires and antenna arrangement one would think it is. I guess this would be N10V as it still has curtains in the windows...
T J
Here is the case I found. 6V on both 9451Z and 52Z.
N9452Z
N9451Z
Are the photos below showing the same a/c? Judging from the colors, polished props, white wall tires and antenna arrangement one would think it is. I guess this would be N10V as it still has curtains in the windows...
T J
Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:22 pm
stoney & jack, thanks for painting in alot of gray areas as to the movie facts, & thanks for the great pics. hope you didn't mind me doing the trivia thread, it was just for mindless fun.
Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:57 pm
"Are the photos below showing the same a/c? Judging from the colors, polished props, white wall tires and antenna arrangement one would think it is. I guess this would be N10V as it still has curtains in the windows... "
No. In the upper photo the B-25 has the old Holley carburetor set up, while in the M&M bottom photo the B-25 has the Hayes modified carburetor set up.
No. In the upper photo the B-25 has the old Holley carburetor set up, while in the M&M bottom photo the B-25 has the Hayes modified carburetor set up.
Wed Dec 03, 2008 8:46 am
Brig. Gen. Dreedle's Executive B-25 was N10V, I believe that she was the only one in the group that had an AirStair Door.
Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:25 am
Absolutely fascinating thread! Read Heller's book in the 60's and used some quotations from it for a Philosophy course on Existentialism in college, got an "A" on the paper. The 25 was always a favorite of mine (I had read Ted Lawson's book "Thirty seconds over Tokyo" in the late 50's). Always wanted to own a B or C with the aft turret and dress it up like "The ruptured Duck". One of the great things about WIX is getting stories of folks who actually participated. My Movie experience lasted three days in February of 67 at Fort Benning. I was a dead North Vietnamese in the "Green Berets". Never have watced it and could care less.
Wed Dec 03, 2008 10:45 am
sgt hawk wrote:Absolutely fascinating thread! Read Heller's book in the 60's and used some quotations from it for a Philosophy course on Existentialism in college, got an "A" on the paper. The 25 was always a favorite of mine (I had read Ted Lawson's book "Thirty seconds over Tokyo" in the late 50's). Always wanted to own a B or C with the aft turret and dress it up like "The ruptured Duck". One of the great things about WIX is getting stories of folks who actually participated. My Movie experience lasted three days in February of 67 at Fort Benning. I was a dead North Vietnamese in the "Green Berets". Never have watced it and could care less.
I'm not a Doctor, but I did play one on TV (in a televison commercial for a local hospital)