Thoughts on Paint Scheme Discussions

[berzer]

ultimately part of what comes with writing the checks is the choices that are made belong to the owner.

Preach on!! Can I get an 'AMEN'?!

errr, AMEN!

[Oscar Duck]

As I have to say sometimes, what colour is yours??? These aircraft represent different things to different folks. Both of my ex-Vietnam war machines are painted in "an" original colour scheme they wore. I mean my 0-1 had North Vietnamese markings on it when we recovered her from Bien Hoa in the late 80's. When we paint stripped her faded and tatty paint we found numerous markings including; South Vietnamese AF, USAF, US Army, US ANG, US Navy ???. Looking through some books we found a photo of my bird when she was flown as "Little Puff" - a 'baby' gunship. I have since meet two pilots and the crew chief of her and have copies of period photos. Now tell me which colour scheme is "correct"??? My 0-2 was found to have been painted all black as well as satandard FAC gray/white. Again which is "correct"??? My Avenger is painted authentically against a photograph of a TBM-3 of VT-83 from USS Essex and I've spoken to the gunner on the original "Georgia Peach"...I have never been able to find any photos of my TBM in service with the USNR at Floyd Bennet Field and Norfolk NAS...again what should I do?? My answer is to honour a vet....

Some folks don't realise that these mach ines costs big $$$ to buy/restore etc etc. A paint job is not cheap and we all are not "rich"...

[Scott Rose]

All I can say Eric is welcome to the world of warbirds on the internet.

There have been many times when I felt that trying to share my airplanes and flying experiences with others through WIX and other forums was a complete waste of time. The world has plenty of nut jobs, and for whatever reason warbird forums seem to collect more than their fair share. Between the anoraks, the neo-nazis (The FW-190 rules!), the self anointed experts (the Bristol Centaurus is the greatest engine ever produced, so why would you fly a bastardized, Americanized Sea Fury with a Wright 3350? ANSWER, because I like to fly rather than sit and watch a Centaurus leak oil in the hanger), the replica guys (You know, I'm building a 3/4 scale B-29 in my garage) and the rude masses (Is that the proper shade of Blue for a Marine Skyraider) it makes you wonder.

Saying all that though, two things keep me coming back.

1. A promise I made to the man who introduced me to warbirds.
2. Meeting people like you.

I had a great time seeing your Skyraider, and meeting your wife and friends. Keep your chin up, and don't let the bastards get to you.

Steve

Just remember, for every goober-neonazi-self-righteous individual of questionable judgement out there there are 15 of us that love and appreciate warbirds such as your and Mr. Downings. Keep in mind there are currently over 600 members of the WIX with only a few bad apples. One of the purposes of this forum was to allow owners and enthusiasts to get together and talk. I appreciate you participation in the forum even in the face of stupidity shown by a handful of people who are essentially jealous of the fact that you have a warbird and they don't.

I hope to one day see your Fury in person and if it takes an American radial to get it in the air then so be it, I'd rather see it in the air than on the ground with an original engine.

[HarvardIV]

srpatterson wrote:

There have been many times when I felt that trying to share my airplanes and flying experiences with others through WIX and other forums was a complete waste of time. The world has plenty of nut jobs, and for whatever reason warbird forums seem to collect more than their fair share. Between the anoraks, the neo-nazis (The FW-190 rules!), the self anointed experts (the Bristol Centaurus is the greatest engine ever produced, so why would you fly a bastardized, Americanized Sea Fury with a Wright 3350?

Agreed, Just like religous extremism; there are folks who take things too far in reading into the FARs. People who want to abuse their knowledge power base to control and demean others.

[Jack Cook]

Chris,
Your posts continue to befuddle me.
Without a doubt you're full enthuasism. But lets be honest, your training, experience and knowledge base just compare with many folks on this board. I'll never fault anyone for posting a correction to one of your misleading replies. Remember that not everyone reads your escape phrases which usually is "I think" or "In my opinion".

[b]Agreed, Just like religous extremism; there are folks who take things too far in reading into the FARs. People who want to abuse their knowledge power base to control and demean others.

This is a perfect example. I did note on your profile that under favorite pastimes you put ARGUING. Maybe this explains it all.
My advice is to reply to the post that your qualified to reply to and leave the technicial stuff to the experts. Remember that they have the training, experience and knowledge you desire. Read their posts and you'll probably learn a few things.
Remeber that just because someone disagrees or corrects one of your posts that doesn't make it a personal attack.
End of rant..................

Oh...one more thing. What the heck is this suppose to mean???

Like a doctor who uses his training to kill people, is the WIXer who uses his knowledge to tear others down.

My dad is a doctor and I work with doctors on a daily basis. All are dedicated professionals. I find your statement quite a bit insulting.

[HarvardIV]

Jack:

I appreciate your candor, and my statement on doctors was meant as an example.

I mean any kind of professional abusing their power to exploit others.

That's what happens on this board.

In fact, one of the warbird pilots had to send me a PM, because several so called "experts" were getting quite abusive. [/quote]

[KarenG]

Hi All,

Since I have, sort of, inadvertantly started this discussion, I would like to make my feelings known. First off, I was not one of the people who PM'd Mr. Downing. I would never be intentionally rude to anyone!

Now, please let me begin by stating this loud and clear!! In my opinion, anyone who purchases a WWII plane has the freedom to paint it anyway they choose. I do not have much of a problem with any plane that was scrapped, or surplus, or decommissioned, or whatever, In that regard what we are talking about is"Military surplus" , being painted pink and purple, with red polka dots, if that is what pleases the owner. If that is what it takes to preserve specimens of these beautiful birds, then by all means knock yourself out!!

Again, for the record, I totally understand, and recognize that Mr. Roush is free to do what he wants with my Uncle's plane, I will be forever in his debt for allowing this plane to fly again!!! .......but in this debate, herein lies the difference.

43-12252 is not "Military Surplus" that was scrapped, or any of the other things that I mentioned earlier. She is the, soon to be, tangible reminder to my family, of the last flight my dear Uncle made before he left this world. She is the visible record, if you will, of the incredible accomplishments of a brave young man, who in his brief life, flew 91 combat missions in 6 months, earned the DFC, at Monte Cassino, logged 194 combat hours, and logged 634 flying hours in less than two years. Was he a "Combat Flying Ace", in my opinion, you are darn right he was, but because he chose to take on the equally dangerous task of flying recon, his accomplishments seem to be easier to dismiss. I beleive had he been a "celebrated" pilot we might not be having this discussion!

In my heart, I beleive that Mr. Roush is unaware of the full story of Dean's life, and experiences. . I also believe that he is a very decent person, and will at least consider my requests, if he ever is fully informed!

I truly believe that in the end, what is meant to be will be. Whatever happens my family will always have all the wonderful memories that we have been blessed with already.

Please guys! Debate this if you want, but don't fight! That doesn't do any of us any good!

Thanks, as always, for listening!

All the best!
Karen

Last edited by KarenG on Sun Apr 10, 2005 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[tom d. friedman]

can't everybody just come in , hang up our egos like our coats after a long day, log on to wix & just talk warbirds?? no doubt some on the site think i'm a individual of questionable judgement, & i really don't care, i speak my piece as a gentleman, & i'm not out to impress anybody. this is supposed to be fun, commaradarie, & all that. i think alot of people on wix take themselves to seriously. nobody has all the answers. i have my strengths on the topic, my weaknesses, & my gray areas, i'll even stand corrected on my next 200 future posts.... no telling when i'll make my next mistake..... hell i probably just made it with this 1!!! lighten up some of you guys!!! we all know who the prima donnas are & so do the ones that are. best, tom

[HarvardIV]

Hi Tom:

Well said, and I appreciate your willingness to talk to the big boys w/o intimidation!

Everybody:

I did talk to to a colleague at the airport about what some of the things that are said on this board, and additionally the politics at the local airport.

We agreed that all aviators/flyers should be kind to eachother, because we want to pursue our flying peacefully. Without running into a bunch of b.s.

Additionally after traveling abroad, I've noticed that people in other countries are much nicer to eachother than we Americans are. Sometimes we really do act like barbarians, and it shows on this message board.

If someone wants to engage in a debate, then do it like a gentleman. Don't be biased, and put others down. If you think someone is wrong quote the FARs and prove it tactfully without reading into it.

[Oscar Duck]

With public property the public should have a say. Privately owned, well enough said. I understand the emotions here. My Spitfire Mk XIV was a combat veteran itself and shot down 4 e/a when flown by an Australian pilot, Tony Gaze, who still is living. I plan to keep the a/c in the colours of her in 1944....

[HarvardIV]

Hi Oscar Duck:

You must be Col Pay then? Can you tell us a little about your Spitfire? Such as how and when it crashed, etc?

Chris

[airnutz]

Hey Tom, Karen, and Rob,
Thank-you for attempting to return to the purpose of Mr Downing's thread.
Chris has at least 2 or 3 threads where this subject started..back to you
Mr. Downing...

[Oscar Duck]

I'm not Col Pay>>>

His Spitfire was a Mk VIII and is now with David Lowy at Temora Aviation Museum.

[EDowning]

In that regard what we are talking about is"Military surplus" , being painted pink and purple, with red polka dots, if that is what pleases the owner. If that is what it takes to preserve specimens of these beautiful birds, then by all means knock yourself out!!

Many of the posts that have replied to my original comments have referred to "polka dots" as an example of the most outlandish military paint scheme that they could think of. I have been most amused by this as my airplane is painted with polka dots (see pis below). A little background, VMA-332 had an air to ground mission in Korea and was tasked to shoot trains, supplies, convoys etc., the Corsairs and Skyraiders of this unit were painted with a blank white box on the side of the aircraft and given a red dot with each ground kill. The unit had great success and soon many of the piolts had multiple red dots(kills), the unit quickly became known as "the polka dots" and painted the wing tips and tails with this honored art.

My Avatar is the unit patch of this unit which later was outfitted with F-18s.

Two other points - I knew virtually nothing of this until I bought the plane and please refer to me as Eric or Sh..head or whatever besides Mr.Downing. I am far to young to be Mr. Downing to anyone.

[Jack Cook]

Eric,
You're in the clear here because the post only refered to purple and poka dots not dark glossy blue. BTW-nice photo. Something extra cool about a AD folding her wings.