F4U-4 Corsair BuNo.97264 debuts new paint

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:05 pm

Just awesome. Any chance at seeing any rockets or bombs underneath the wings? :wink:

RMAllnutt · **Posted:** Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:09 pm

Warbird Kid wrote:

Just awesome. Any chance at seeing any rockets or bombs underneath the wings? :wink:

You know... as cool as it looks, all that extra drag is terrible on fuel economy... not to mention glide performance in an engine out situation. I still ache for the loss of Joe Tobul.... he might still be with us had he just a little less drag from all those rockets. Safety first and looks second in my book.

Richard

Warbird Kid · **Posted:** Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:31 pm

I never read the accident report about Joe before. I didn't know it was caused potentially by all the extras on the wings!

Too sad.

B-25 C · **Posted:** Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:05 pm

Good looking War Bird! :f4u:

warbird1 · **Joined:** Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:25 pm **Posts:** 2760

Warbird Kid wrote:

I never read the accident report about Joe before. I didn't know it was caused potentially by all the extras on the wings!

Too sad.

Here's the accident report:

http://ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20 ... 5462&key=1

It's unknown whether the extra drag was causal to the accident, but I agree with RMAllnut's point - safety should always trump everything. That is a lot of extra drag and not something I would want to have on my airplane if I were operating in mountainous or heavily wooded areas.

Rob Mears · **Posted:** Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:10 pm

If it were me, I'd simply have my ground crew bring along the rockets and dummy bombs to specific events and attach them to the plane for static display and judging purposes. Even arranging the ordinance on the ground under the wings would make for an excellent presentation IMO. The Air Force does it all the time for photo ops and air shows.

Django, drop an e-mail to Alan Woodson at www.texasaerocolor.com and he can tell you exactly what was used. He mentioned the paint specifics to me during my visit but I can't recall at the moment.

mh53eflyguy · **Joined:** Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:30 pm **Posts:** 98

warbird1 wrote:

Warbird Kid wrote:

I never read the accident report about Joe before. I didn't know it was caused potentially by all the extras on the wings!

Too sad.

Here's the accident report:

http://ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20 ... 5462&key=1

It's unknown whether the extra drag was causal to the accident, but I agree with RMAllnut's point - safety should always trump everything. That is a lot of extra drag and not something I would want to have on my airplane if I were operating in mountainous or heavily wooded areas.

Forgive me, and with all due respect to the friends and family members of Joe Tobul, but I didn't see anything stated regarding the dummy bombs or missiles listed in the NTSB report. While I understand that you are eluding to the extra parasite drag that these items cause (undeniable), I don't know what this has to do with, or could factor into a different outcome, but even with that, I strongly feel that it is a moot point and somewhat inappropriate to incorporate into the NTSB findings. I will probably erupt a firestorm over that comment, but I strongly dislike when folks dispute facts found in an NTSB report, or add a spin to them. That being said, I'm going to somewhat gingerly state the following. These are supposed to be unbiased reports, and they usually are. I'm not a Warbird pilot, but I am a pilot, and I'm not familiar with that area of SC. I'd imagine that being low and slow in a landing profile on a base leg with a crippled engine did not help his glide rate, but add a heavy bird to the mix (heavier than a Cessna 172) with a glide ratio that would already rival a brick, you have even less time and options before altitude and airspeed are now but wishful thinking when your engine isn't producing sufficient power. Being an aircraft accident static (and survivor) and having people comment on it myself, It strikes a nerve.

On a different note, the new F4U-4's paint scheme; I do want to say that the new paint scheme is awe-inspiring and breathtaking! A job well done!

RMAllnutt · **Posted:** Sat Dec 19, 2009 2:59 pm

mh53eflyguy wrote:

warbird1 wrote:

Warbird Kid wrote:

I never read the accident report about Joe before. I didn't know it was caused potentially by all the extras on the wings!

Too sad.

Here's the accident report:

http://ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20 ... 5462&key=1

It's unknown whether the extra drag was causal to the accident, but I agree with RMAllnut's point - safety should always trump everything. That is a lot of extra drag and not something I would want to have on my airplane if I were operating in mountainous or heavily wooded areas.

Forgive me, and with all due respect to the friends and family members of Joe Tobul, but I didn't see anything stated regarding the dummy bombs or missiles listed in the NTSB report. While I understand that you are eluding to the extra parasite drag that these items cause (undeniable), I don't know what this has to do with, or could factor into a different outcome, but even with that, I strongly feel that it is a moot point and somewhat inappropriate to incorporate into the NTSB findings. I will probably erupt a firestorm over that comment, but I strongly dislike when folks dispute facts found in an NTSB report, or add a spin to them. That being said, I'm going to somewhat gingerly state the following. These are supposed to be unbiased reports, and they usually are. I'm not a Warbird pilot, but I am a pilot, and I'm not familiar with that area of SC. I'd imagine that being low and slow in a landing profile on a base leg with a crippled engine did not help his glide rate, but add a heavy bird to the mix (heavier than a Cessna 172) with a glide ratio that would already rival a brick, you have even less time and options before altitude and airspeed are now but wishful thinking when your engine isn't producing sufficient power. Being an aircraft accident static (and survivor) and having people comment on it myself, It strikes a nerve.

On a different note, the new F4U-4's paint scheme; I do want to say that the new paint scheme is awe-inspiring and breathtaking! A job well done!

Sorry if I upset you. I never said that the rockets were a causal factor in the accident. The engine losing power was the cause. What I was trying to say was that without that extra drag, it might have been possible to put the bird down in a less dangerous location. From what I understand, Joe deliberately avoided housing when he went in. He was a real hero in my book, and having met and spoken by phone with him on a number of occasions, I felt more than the usual level of sadness at his untimely death. He was a really good guy, and I miss him.

All the best,
Richard

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F4U-4 Corsair BuNo.97264 debuts new paint

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