Warbird Information Exchange

Do any real airframes exist? Wiki list 2 survivors. One at the NMUSAF that I've never seen and another at Hurlburt. Is the one at at Hurlburt an actual "A"C-119?

Also what equipment would be needed to outfit a Boxcar as Shadow or Stinger?

Thanks

Shay
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Semper Fortis

I remember that AC-119K at Andrews on September 16, 1972. I was there that day for the USAF 25th Anniversary Air Show at Andrews AFB. GREAT air show. A week later on September 25, 1972 I began my enlistment in the Air Force and headed for San Antonio.

Very cool. Now if someone ever comes up with pictures of Fifi and Diamond Lil at the Dayton Air Show in 1994, it'll be the same for me.

Shay
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Semper Fortis

You may want to check out this site. Pretty cool.
http://www.ac-119gunships.com/welcome.htm

I think the one at Hurlburt is the real deal. I heard that the NMUSAF has a AC-119 in storage somehwere on the base, but I have never seen any evidence of it so for now would chalk that up to hangar gossip.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

Is there anyone at the museum you could ask to verify if that is true and maybe get a Serial No.?

Shay
____________
Semper Fortis

JI have never been able to find anything out about it. I think we are going to see some interesting stuff when the new building goes up, and the stuff in storage gets moved around a bit.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

The aircraft on display at Hurlburt is not a real gunship. Here is information from the Air Force
Data Sheet for it:

C-119G TAIL #53-3144 HISTORY
The aircraft in the airpark is a C-119G model received by the Air Force on April 23, 1954. It served troop carrier assignments with both the active and reserve forces in Japan, Oregon, Texas and Rhode Island. The Air Force retired it to storage at the "Boneyard" at Davis-Monthan Air Force Base before selling it to a private individual in 1975. Its next assignment involved agricultural spraying for grasshoppers until that became unprofitable. The owners then turned to contraband and delivered television sets from Texas into Mexico. Customers bought the TV sets directly from the aircraft. On its sixth and final illegal operation, it was damaged when it struck a large cactus tree in the middle of an airstrip. It returned to the United States and sat at Laredo, Texas, until sold again to a private individual who exchanged it and an AT-11 for a Beechcraft U-8 and a C-118. In 1987, the aircraft flew to Hurlburt for display in the airpark in honor of all commandos who served on this type of aircraft. It arrived Sept. 23 after being chased by Customs and Drug Enforcement Agency aircraft after Beaumont, Texas, and New Orleans. The pilot had no aircraft radios and failed to file a flight plan. When he was picked up on radar and couldn't be contacted, he was considered a drug smuggler. Following engine and propeller changes and other work, the aircraft was moved to the airpark and installed June 28, 1988.

That is very interesting. One heck of a history. They did a nice job of modifying it to an AC-119.

_________________
Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

In 1978 or 1979, I worked at the Pima Air Museum in Tucson as a volunteer during the summers of high school. I was asked by Jim Davis, one of the restoration staff members, to accompany him on a 'mission'. Jim said that the fire department at Davis Monthan Air Force Base had been given an AC-119 gunship out of the bone yard for fire practice and training. He wanted to remove all of the special gunship gear for the museum before the aircraft was burned up. Jim had been given permission by the fire chief to do so so off we went.

Most of the aircraft at Pima had come from DMAFB and were towed through the desert through the back fence. Jim had a key to the back fence at DM and he didn't want to drive all the way around to the main gate so we went through the back door. We drove his old pickup truck around the runway and flight line over the AC-119 and started to work. We removed all of the gun and canon mounts and anything else we thought we should save. I even took a control wheel and a data plate as a souvenir.

I was up in one of the booms removing oxygen bottles for the B-29 and when I came down the ladder i heard a voice say "You, come here now". I looked over to see an MP standing on the other side of a chain link fence holding an M16. I turned to call for Jim to tell him that we had a problem when the MP said in a much more stern voice said "YOU COME HERE NOW!" and then he leveled his M16 at me. I didn't need much more convincing to do as he asked so I trotted over to him quickly. He wanted to know what I was doing there and he didn't seem to believe that some civilians had permission to take government property. Shortly thereafter several other MP's showed up and had Jim and I handcuffed with all of our pockets emptied on the hood of the Military Police Car.

Understandable they didn't believe Jim at his word that we had permission to be there and when asked how we got on the base they were dumbfounded to find out that he had his own key to the back gate.

Jim told them to check with the fire chief and they were doing just that but poor old Jim was steaming mad at being arrested. It was 110 degrees that day which seemed cool by comparison to Jim's temper. I still remember looking over to see Jim's hands handcuffed behind his back, leaning against the front fender of the Military Police car. He was working those hand cuffs back and forth on that fender scratching off all the paint he could!

After about 45 minutes we were released to go back to work. Jim was also livid because they didn't even apologize.

I still have that control wheel and data plate mounted on a wood plaque I made in high school wood shop. In 1980 while on a B-29 flight to England we stopped at Loring AFB in Maine for repairs and I met a B-52 pilot that flew AC-119's. He said he had flown 30+ missions in them. I told him about my AC-119 experience at DM and he wondered what the serial number was. I called my mother and had her read the serial number off of the data plate and it turned out that this was the aircraft that he flew most of his missions in. Sad that it ended its days being burned up at DM.

I have often wondered what happened to the gunship equipment at Pima. It may have been tossed out in one of the cleaning sessions or maybe it is still there. I also wonder what became of Jim Davis too. He sure was good to me and I learned a lot about Warbirds from him. Nothing but great memories about those days at Pima.

Taigh

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To donate to the PV-2D project via PayPal click here http://www.twinbeech.com/84062restoration.htm

We brought her from: to this in 3 months: Help us get her all the way back

All donations are tax deductible as the Stockton Field Aviation Museum is a 501c3 nonprofit organization. Tell a friend as the Harpoon needs all the help she can get.

Thank you!

Taigh Ramey
Vintage Aircraft, Stockton, California
http://www.twinbeech.com
'KEEP ‘EM FLYING…FOR HISTORY!'

Awesome stuff.

Anyone know why some "K" Stingers had 3 bladed props and others had 4 blades?

Shay
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Semper Fortis

Lots of info on Stingers at this site: http://atterburybakalarairmuseum.org/mo ... photos.htm


PJ
PV-2 Harpoon "Hot Stuff"
www.amhf.org

Ref: C119s at Atterbury. When I got off active duty (flew HH43s) in 1967 I joined up with
the 72nd Troop Carrier Sqdn. The sister squadron to the 71st that was activated to SEA.
So I flew the C119s until they were taken and modified for the AC119 mission.
On the Atterbury-Bakalar site the one picture is of one of my C119 instructors Maj. Herman Heuss.
We moved the a/c to Grissom AFB and soon there after the 71st was activated and C119s
taken for modification and SEA duty.
Those of us in the 72nd converted to U3s for a while. Eventually we transitioned to FAC
duties in the O2 then eventually into the A37 A/B. All of these at Grissom.
Neil J. McC

Shay,

Reference your question about three blade vs four bladed props: The 4 blade Aeroproducts propellers
had a problem with overspeeding. Therefore, in the last few years of the C-119 operation, there were some surplus
C-121 aircraft (Connie) Hamilton Standard three bladed propellers available. The USAF used these surplus Hamilton Standard three bladed propellers to begin converting the C-119 fleet. Since the three bladed propellers were not as efficient as the 4 bladed Aeroproducts propellers, not many were changed over to the three bladed propellers.
Some old C-119 flight engineer's say the three bladed propellers were quieter.... However, It was always noisy in a C-119,
regardless of which propeller it had. But, the safety folks felt it was safer because it corrected the overspeed issue.