Looking for a book on aviation cinema

rreis · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:42 pm **Posts:** 441

Hi all

A great amount of articles in wikipedia covering aviation films quote this:

Quote:

Harwick, Jack and Ed Schnepf. "A Viewer's Guide to Aviation Movies". The Making of the Great Aviation Films, General Aviation Series, Volume 2, 1989.

but I can't find it anywhere. Does anyone has any info on this book?

best

Fleet16b · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 9:06 am

Another great book on aviation films is "Celluloid Wings".
I came across it years ago in a library but have never seen a copy since.It covered all aviation films made up to I think about the 70's

rreis · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:42 pm **Posts:** 441

fleet16b wrote:

Another great book on aviation films is "Celluloid Wings".
I came across it years ago in a library but have never seen a copy since.It covered all aviation films made up to I think about the 70's

That one is not so difficult to find:

http://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl ... 20aviation

But this one... I only find the wikipedia references

Jerry O'Neill · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:14 pm

Here's a few I own that I'd recommend:

The Air Devils, Don Dwiggins. Lots of early stunt flying stories and many have to do with film

Hollywood Pilot: The Biography of Paul Mantz, Don Dwiggins

Aviation in the Cinema, Stephen Pendo

The Motion Picture Stunt Pilots and Hollywood's Classic Aviation Movies, H. Hugh Wynne

Broken Wings: Hollywood's Air Crashes, James H. Farmer

When Hollywood Ruled the Skies, Bruce W. Orriss (classic WWII Aviation films)

Stunt Flying in the Movies, Jim & Maxine Greenwood

Wings on the Screen: a pictorial History of Air Movies, Bertil Skogsberg

Also, don't over look some of the books about the history of war films. Laurence Suid's "Guts & Glory", has some great info on several aviation films especially "Tora, Tora, Tora". It's a must read.

Also, Frank Tallman's "Flying the Old Planes" has a lot of film history in it, especially about Catch-22.

Jerry

Roger Cain · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:51 pm

fleet16b wrote:

Another great book on aviation films is "Celluloid Wings".
I came across it years ago in a library but have never seen a copy since.It covered all aviation films made up to I think about the 70's

Although the other book didn't show up, Fleet16 can find his book at Abe's, they have a good collection listing, and a want list that lets me know when a book I'm looking for comes intio the system.
Celluloid Wings: http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchR ... &x=59&y=10

airknocker · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:26 pm

Here is a list from Aerofiles:
http://www.aerofiles.com/film.html

rreis · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:42 pm **Posts:** 441

Thanks all for you kind help. Some of the books Jerry mentioned I already have, others I do not. Aerofiles is an excellent reference too, thanks airknocker. And I finally decided to get "celluloid wings"...

Right now I'm looking for books for a very specific purpose. The films I'm interested for it are those relating to aviation exploits - especially raids, and pioneering stuff. Some that are already on my list (no particular order):

- "They Flew Alone", by director-producer Herbert Wilcox, 1942
- "The red tent", Mikhail Kalatozov., 1969
- "The Spirit of St. Louis", Billy Wilder, 1957
- "The right stuff", Philip Kaufman, 1983
- "Only Angels Have Wings", Howard Hawks, 1939
- "Those Magnificent Men in their Flying Machines, Or How I Flew from London to Paris in 25 Hours 11 Minutes", Ken Annakin, 1965.
- "Baboona", Mrs&Mr Martin Johnson, 1935
- "Air Mail", John Ford, 1932

If you have any suggestion I would love to read it but please, I'm not looking for great aviation films. I'm looking for pioneer/aviation exploits stuff. And if you don't understand my choices please come forward, or I can convince you or I'll review my stance.

The Inspector · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 10:09 pm

Seem to remember a book called, I think, 'The Black Cats' about the 13 folks (including at least one gal) who pioneered avation stunts for the movies in the early 1920's like the ttransfer to and replace a tire in flight footage on a Standard.

JBoyle · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 10:36 pm

Revolution in the Sky has information on the Lockheed Vega Mantz wrecked during filming of Only Angeles have Wings.
It was C/n 100, NC48M and lost near St. George, Utah on Dec 13, 1939.
The Vega was replaced with another type for the scenes where the new pilot flies a doctor to an accident victim.

For information on the filming of The Right Stuff, try old Air Classics from 1982. They did several stories on the filming.
and I believe there was an English book on "Those magnificent men...". Try Amazon UK...or the FlyPast forum.

Jerry O'Neill · **Posted:** Sun Dec 12, 2010 11:08 pm

I don't have it in front of me right now, but there are these smaller books about various films. Usually more like
a dissection of the film by a noted author. I have one for the "Right Stuff" and "Jaws". There's a lot of extra info in these books, sometimes about the filming versus strictly about the script.
Jerry

JDK · **Posted:** Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:18 am

Very interesting stuff, but...

100% failure on actually answering the question. Lucky it's not an exam! :Hangman:

To join the illustrious list of those failing to track down rreis' book, :lol:

I'll just add that it seems to me that it may be a magazine or periodical partwork, rather than a book, going by how it's cited on the Firefox movie Wiki page. The format seems consistent with the other magazines, and does not have an ISBN like the other books. I'll have a further think and look.

rreis wrote:

...The films I'm interested for it are those relating to aviation exploits - especially raids, and pioneering stuff.

In English you don't mean 'raids' but record-setting or record-breaking flights. The French use of the word 'raid' for these has not translated into English, but we use 'raid' to mean either a military-type operation, going into an objective, or nowadays also a complex robbery or similar.

Quote:

- "Those Magnificent Men in their Flying Machines, Or How I Flew from London to Paris in 25 Hours 11 Minutes", Ken Annakin, 1965.

You have the book 'Building the aircraft for those Magnificent Men' by Air Commodore Allan Wheeler?

Quote:

- "Baboona", Mrs&Mr Martin Johnson, 1935

I have 'I Married Adventure' by Osa Johnson, but it doesn't talk much about filming.

Are you looking at TV stuff as well? the Australian series 'A Thousand Skies' on Smithy is pretty good, as well as 'The Great Air Race' on the 1934 MacRobertson Air Race.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0098812/

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088630/

Jerry O'Neill wrote:

I don't have it in front of me right now, but there are these smaller books about various films. Usually more like a dissection of the film by a noted author. I have one for the "Right Stuff" and "Jaws". There's a lot of extra info in these books, sometimes about the filming versus strictly about the script.

Are you thinking of the British Film Institute (BFI) Film Guides?

http://bfifilmbookguide.blogspot.com/

Be that as it may, I'd certainly recommend rreis' have a look at / ask a staffer at the BFI library for the mystery book. I found them very helpful when I worked in London. They have a splendid slide set of the Grumman Duck and Peter O'Toole from Murphy's War.

http://www.bfi.org.uk/filmtvinfo/

HTH,

rreis · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:42 pm **Posts:** 441

James, it's always a delight to read you. Yes, 100% off the mark but what would have I missed if not for all this gunfire going by? Probably it's better to have it like this

Yes, I got the book on those "Magnificent men", excellent read (and last week I just finished "How they made Piece of Cake" because I read your recommendation on key. What about that?)

Thanks for the clarification in the "Raid" term, I wasn't aware of it. here in Portugal we also use Raid, so... After reading books in so many languages sometimes we forget there are limits to overlapping.

TV stuff? Yeah, sure. The idea will be to screen this in a proper cinema but I think it goes well. Especially if it allows to illustrate events not depicted on "normal" film.

Right now am I thinking on which Amelia film to select... the more recent one, from last year or these, quoted in aerofiles...

Quote:

Amelia Earhart (Universal Television 1976, 150m) D: George Schaefer. Susan Clark = Amelia Earhart, John Forsythe = George Putnam, Stephen Macht = Paul Mantz, Susan Oliver = Neta Snook, Jane Wyatt = Amy Earhart. Screenplay: Carol Sobieski. Golden Globe nomination for Best Movie Made For TV 1977. Amelia Earhart, The Final Flight (1994, 120m) D: Yves Simoneau. David Carpenter = Harry Kanning, Bruce Dern = George Putnam, Diane Keaton = Amelia Earhart, Paul Guilfoyle = Paul Mantz, Rutger Hauer = Fred Noonan. Screenplay: Doris L Rich, Anna Sandor. Emmy nominations for Outstanding Lead Actress (Keaton), Outstanding Camera Production (Michael Ornstein) 1995; Golden Globe nomination for Best Actress in a Motion Picture Made for TV (Keaton) 1995; SAG nomination for Outstanding Actress in a TV Movie (Keaton) 1995. Maltin review: "Keaton's single-minded Earhart is the center of this stunningly photographed, beautifully appointed, though indifferently acted bio, an episodic recreation of the aviatrix's lifelong fascination with aviation ending with her luckless last flight in 1937. Dern does a nice turn as publisher Putnam, her impresario husband/manager/press agent."

Trivia: (1) On departing from Miami, mountains are seen in the background but Florida there is flat as a pancake. (2) At the picnic, mustard comes from squeeze-bottles, which hadn't been invented yet.

has anyone seen them?

JDK · **Posted:** Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:04 am

Glad it was of interest, as were all the other suggestions, my cheap shots aside.

I've asked a friend of mine about the mystery book, and we'll see...

Amelia. As an aviation enthusiast and a reasonably discerning film watcher, I can certainly recommend the recent film. It's neither a great piece of cinematic art, but nor is it as bad as its box-office shortfall would imply. There's lots of good flying (although not too much!) some done by several WIX members here - fleet16b and Eric Presten.

Another for your list might be 'Ceiling Zero' starring Jimmy Cagney. Although derived from a stage play, and thus more in the flight office than featuring actual flying, it's good on the change from the devil-may care mail pilot pioneers to the more procedural careful 'company men'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ceiling_zero.jpg

Can't go wrong with the rest of your list, particularly Hawk's Only Angels..., while your challenge will be to get Porco Rosso in there! Pioneering air pirate?

Calling Baranca...

ZeamerB17 · **Posted:** Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:21 am

As Ed Schnepf is one of the authors, I suspect it was published by Challenge Publications, where he was/is? the top guy/CEO/owner for a long time. So, it is most likely one of their special edition magazines.

AHA!! - I just found it! When in doubt; if you are looking for something a bit obscure - eBay to the rescue. :wink:

VOILA:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Making-Great-Aviati ... 35a891cbfc

Giddyup! :drink3:

JDK · **Posted:** Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:23 am

All hail Zeamer! :prayer:

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