AIRLINE STRANDING LAW RESULTS

[the330thbg]

It is a good law for those of us that actually have to spend a lot of time travelling vs. those who just like to uphold raw capitalism at any cost. (but rarely actually have to deal with the situation.)

It is a good law., yes.., but to get around it your airline is just going to cancel your flight rather than pay the fine.

The reason you are delayed and sitting on the ground in the first place is the government ATC system. Which is overloaded and underfunded.

[the330thbg]

[quote="Bill Greenwood"]330, your source for Kansas City says delays over 3 hours down to only 4 this June vs 265 last June.

Sounds like a major improvement to me.
And since ATC has not updated, the improvement cant't be due to them, it must be the airlines, and in part the weather or how the airlines handle the weather delays.[quote]

Bill, you are contradicting yourself as well.
I said the airlines are cancelling their flights due to the new restrictions. You said 'prove it'. I did.

You said the airlines are cutting their delays because of the gubmint mandate! I said no. You said prove it. I did.

The article proves exactly what I stated. The delays are down and the cancellations are up. Just like I stated. Instead of paying the fines., the airlines cancel the flights. Just like in the article.

What else are you looking for in this?

[the330thbg]

by the way

I love your Spitfire!!!

Thanks for sharing her with us!!!!

[Enemy Ace]

Okay 330th,
Reality check time. ATC can and does provide for delays, however in the last 5 years without thinking real hard I can recall:
at least 3 mechanical delays, 2 of which were at regional airports where we sat on the plane for @2+ hours while they tried to find a mechanic. If they had let me out I could have caught a different flight and made my connections downline.
3-4 times weather, it was raining/snowing/blowing like all heck, I remember looking at weather channel before boarding, destination airports just as bad. Sure enough, we boarded, taxiied out....and sat there. Why???
several times boarded, sat and waited for the connecting crew to show up.
lost track of how many times we showed up on time (not early) and then sat there for an eternity because our gate was occupied...
Most problems are on in-country (USA) flights. Have very rarely experienced any problems flying International. IMHO Lufthansa is the best Airline in the world, they have their act together for departure and arrival. As opposed to arriving at say Atlanta Hartsfield, there is nobody at the gate to meet our flight, some minimum wage ape comes out and stares at us for a few minutes and then goes back in the terminal.
Some delays are ATC related but not all. Please lighten up on Bill, he needs daily beatings but you can only take it so far.

[jtramo]

Proof means nothing here! The airlines were....... the second gunman on the grassy knoll, self destructed Flight 800, actually own the airspace surrounding Area 51, Shot that Missile off the coast of LA last week, have bigfoot loading bags in Seatac, flew 14 747s in a circle over the South African coast creating hurricane Katrina (they practice this over the Bermuda triangle every few years), caused both stock market crashes, denied the Virgin Mary boarding, created the reality TV show "The Jersey Shore," blew up the Hindenburg.....and.....PURPOSELY TRAP YOU IN THE BACK OF AIRPLANES!

The fact that Bill is ignoring is that this matter has been investigated by every liberal and conservative media outlet and government agency......and they all acknowledge that cancellations have gone through the roof. Google it. The same passenger "advocacy" groups that pushed for this rule are now crying because of its effects.

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-1 ... -rule.html

3HR rule = massive cancellations. CASE CLOSED!

PS and we are wixers, not "the airlines people on wix."

[the330thbg]

If he had a creative lawyer, maybe they could claim that he forgot that he was in a taxi and really thought that he was an airline and the passenger should not have any rights.
One difference is that a taxi passenger pays after getting to the destination, and an airline passenger has to pay before the trip.
One similarity is that the cab driver, like the airlines didn't seem to think he'd done anything wrong to hold the lady against her will and that the passenger was not owed even common courtesy or an apology.

You are not going to let this discussion go.., are you Bill?

By your continued rant on this forum.., How old are you?

[jtramo]

Do you think the passage of a three-hour tarmac delay rule has had a positive impact on passengers?
No, long tarmac delays may be down, but cancellations are up. I'd rather wait a little longer and get to my destination. 64.31%
Yes, numbers show that extended tarmac delays are down. 18.40%
Don't know. There are so many conflicting opinions from government and industry analysts, I don't know whom to believe. 17.29%

[brucev]

good or bad the law came about because of a few cases that frankly were outrageous (134 people on a Jet Blue aircraft for 11 hrs in NY). If the airline or the airport authority in question used just a little common sense this law would never have come about. Lets be honest, after 4 or 5 hrs that aircraft was never going to depart, holding the pax onboard another 6-7 hrs was as idiotic as some of the excuses offered afterward.

USA Today article about the effects of the new law here http://travel.usatoday.com/flights/2010-12-07-airline-on-time-performance-october_N.htm

interesting quotes from the article: "U.S. airlines have finally eradicated the thorny problem of lengthy tarmac delays — at least for a month.
The nation's 18 largest airlines reported that there were no flights in October that had tarmac delays of more than three hours, compared to 11 a year ago, according to monthly data released Tuesday by the Department of Transportation's Bureau of Transportation Statistics"

"Contrary to airlines' fears, the cancellation rate in October remained steady at 0.97% — or 5,275 of 545,500 flights scheduled for the month — compared to 0.99% a year ago"

"Meanwhile, the carriers' on-time performance also improved in October. Nearly 84% of flights arrived within 15 minutes of schedule, up from 77.3% a year ago. It fell slightly from September 2010's 85.1%."

so is the cancellation rate up or not?

330bg, what is your fascination with random large text?

[Bill Greenwood]

Brucev,

That was wonderful! At least in my opinion, for what it was worth.

You have stated the case as you see it, simply and without rancor, and given facts to back it up , including the reference to the article.

Now, maybe I like it more because the facts agree with me, but I really think you did a nice job in your post. How about more on other topics?

Good sense, and manners, and staying on topic, are sometimes a little hard to find on WIX, with folks from so many diverse outlooks, and often so passionate about a subject.

I don't have any ponies to award, but I have about 1720 of them that are resting for another or so, how about a ride some day?

[brucev]

thank you Bill your compliment is appreciated!, don't elevate me too high though as I've made my share of illiterate and hotheaded posts before.

The offer of a ride is enough to keep me wake all night! (and possibly put me on a diet)

[jtramo]

That report was only about November. Here is Sept.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-0 ... -rule.html

U.S. airlines canceled 4,754 flights in September, a 62 percent jump from the same month a year ago, as the government requires carriers to let passengers off stuck flights within three hours.

The cancellation rate, rising to 0.9 percent from 0.57 percent in September 2009, has increased in four of five months since the Transportation Department imposed a rule April 29 to discourage airlines from keeping passengers on delayed aircraft

Airlines said the requirement would lead to cancellations, and as of September an additional 5,000 flights were scrapped, an 18 percent rise, since the rule took effect.

[the330thbg]

Don't bother. Facts are useless here.

[Bill Greenwood]

330, facts are very welcome here, but don't select only those that agree with you and ignore those that are at odds with the gloom or doom, strand or cancel view, that JTramo is offering.

Sept facts are interesting, but the facts Brucev gave for November are the latest available. They are also from a mainstream source.

We won't have an in depth comparison of operations before and after the law, until a year or so goes by.
And you may have the preference or make the choice that you'd rather be stranded on an airliner, indefinitely, even overnght, than risk having a flight canceled.
But do you have the right to make that choice for the other passengers, especailly the elderly or parents with kids?

For me, I just rode home on United, in bad weather, marginal and in rain just above freezing. It was nice to get to the destination, but it is VERY reasuring to know that I am not going to be sitting on the plane over 3 hours.

[the330thbg]

USA Today article...

LMFAO

You get your NEWS from USA Today?

[brucev]

yes i oftenread USA Today