A-31/A-35 Vengeance

Nathan · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 1:53 pm

I like the oddball types and always end up forgetting about one when I make my lists. The Vultee Vengeance!

Some units did see combat like those from the Australian units fighting in the South Pacific. I was surprised to read some were assigned to the 8th Air Force. But these were used from "April 1944, a number of Vengeance Mk IV series Is were made available to the 8th Air Force and assigned to tow-target flights and Combat Crew Replacement Centers (CCRC) stations". (has anyone seen any of the A-35's in England? Perhaps in the background of photos, etc?)

Looking for feedback and chat about this type.

Thanks,
Nathan

TonyM · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:06 pm

Nathan,

On page 144 of Martin Bowman's "THE USAAF HANDBOOK 1939-1945" there is a photo of A-35 41-31369 being used in UK by 8th AF.

TonyM.

Nathan · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 3:09 pm

Thanks Tony.

I am kind of curious what the A-35 would do for the Combat Crew Replacement Center. I am guessing this unit dealt with finding replacement crews for lost bomber crews?

The Inspector · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:30 pm

Squadron hack, 'it's here, it's available, take it' but may have had more 'brio' than driving up in a T-6 or more oddball 'dig me' than an L-5-

Steve Nelson · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:36 pm

The Vengeance has always been one of my favorites. I'd never heard of the thing until I saw the old Fr0g 1/72 kit at a model show back in the early 80s. The fuselage is rather plain-jane, but that weird double-tapered wing is just too cool.

As for 8th AF Vengeances, here are a couple of pics that turned up in a quick Google image search. The first has the "Triangle W" of the 398th BG on the tail

The aircraft in the second pic carries the tail markings of the 384th BG, and you can make out the small "WW" under the serial number, for "War Weary." Such aircraft were often used as squadron hacks.

Second Air Force · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:42 pm

Nathan wrote:

Thanks Tony.

I am kind of curious what the A-35 would do for the Combat Crew Replacement Center. I am guessing this unit dealt with finding replacement crews for lost bomber crews?

Nathan,

The Combat Crew Replacement Center was an orientation center for replacement crews that arrived in England from the CONUS training schools. These men had been deemed ready for shipment overseas but went to the CCRC for in-theater training before being shipped off to a combat unit. You will often find stories of crews that got a brand-new Fort or Liberator and headed to England only to lose the airplane to the Depot and them being sent to either their new bomb group or to the Replacement Center, depending on the need at the time.

The Vengeances were used for "utility" purposes, not unlike the A-25s were used at the stateside training bases. Target tow, instrument proficiency, monthly flight time for deskbound aviators, etc.

red two · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:07 pm

I've always liked the Vultee Vengance. That aircraft never got any love from anybody. Not to hijack your thread, but what about other oddballs, like the O-47?

Dan K · **Posted:** Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:17 pm

Steve Nelson wrote:

The Vengeance has always been one of my favorites...The fuselage is rather plain-jane, but that weird double-tapered wing is just too cool.

I concur, Steve (the "too cool" angle just one more time!). :wink:

TonyM · **Posted:** Mon Feb 28, 2011 7:42 am

red two wrote:

I've always liked the Vultee Vengance. That aircraft never got any love from anybody. Not to hijack your thread, but what about other oddballs, like the O-47?

I always liked the North American O-47.

TM

Cvairwerks · **Posted:** Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:48 am

Interesting to note that he has the boards out, so he's going to go vertical......pointed down though.

jdvoss · **Posted:** Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:51 am

Unfortunatly only ONE Vengeance survives today and is on display at the Camden Air Museum just on the western outskirts of Sydney. It is a Mk1a and interestingly it is the very last A-31 produced by the Northrop Corporation. I visited the air museum a few years back and due to the lack of lighting in the building my photo didn't turn out well at all (a reason to go back!). Apparently there are a couple of intact fuselages remaining in Australia and efforts are being made to scrounge parts from wrecks to complete another airframe.

As a point of interest the Vengeance was operated by the RAF (13 sqdns), Royal Navy ( 3 sqnds), Indian AF (2 sqdns), Brazilian AF (2 sqdns), French AF (3 sqdns) and of the course the RAAF (5 sqdns). At one point in time the USN was interested in the type and gave it the designation of TBV but that is about as far as it went. There is an outstanding book called "Vengeance" by Peter C. Smith, hrdbnd, 188 pgs which is an outstanding reference. He comments that after the war an individual purchased 19 aircraft for 5 Australian pounds each!!...for scrapping of course.

jasonp51d · **Posted:** Mon Feb 28, 2011 12:45 pm

Also used as a target tug by some units - here's one with ther 1st Gunnery and Tow target flight attached to the 361st FG.

sagindragin · **Posted:** Mon Feb 28, 2011 8:24 pm

also,

the only divebomber to dive vertical, and i mean straight down

john,
the owner of the only accurate drawings of the vengeance fuselage :lol:

Jollygreenslugg · **Posted:** Tue Mar 01, 2011 12:30 am

They're huge inside!

1993. I don't know why I was worried, perhaps it was being caught playing aeroplanes!

Cheers,
Matt

Nathan · **Posted:** Tue Mar 01, 2011 12:37 am

Awesome!

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