Warbird Information Exchange

Hopefully they challenge it in Ohio as well. Especially now that the Intrepid is stating that they are not sure they have the means to display and preserve the Shuttle.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

I suggest you look at the shuttles disposal plan, affirmed by Congress in the National aeronautics and Space Authoriaztion Act of 2010.

Once again this administration by passed the Congress of the US ... But then, it's not the first time nor will it be the last time.

I guess they feel it's more important for foreign visitors to view a shuttle then the American taxpayers who footed the bill.

I suggest those of you in the Mid-West that are upset, contact your two Senators and Member of the House and ask them why they allow to be by passed by this Administration.

I guess Harry Reid, Nany Pelosi (close to LA) and Schumer & Wiener in NY carry more weight than the taxpayers.

Personally, more than 50 years ago I had my boots covered with mud and human fertilizer in Korea and now this admistration has kicked manure in my face and veteran's throughout the country.

As to Pensacola, it's a great Museum but it is in Florida with Kennedy and it's $41 admission. The NMUSAF's admission is $00.00

The beauty of WIX is it's diversity and civility ... with a big thanks to Scott for all he does and provide.

On a side note, Militarily I have flown on the following C-46, C-54, C-47, C-119, C-124 and the Chickasaw .... Are they warbirds?

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Jerry
S/Sgt. - USAF Radio Operator '52-'56
C-119 "Flying Boxcar" - Korea & Japan

Volunteer: National Museum of the US Air Force (2007-2016)
LTM 381st Bomb Group Memorial Association

tex-fan,

Typically when Congress wants to direct a federal agency to do something (or not to do something) it is done through the power of the purse. Technically most federal agencies are underneath the executive branch- Congress authorizes their purpose and funding, and the President directs the agencies as they carry out their assigned tasks. This is the way "pork barrel" funding works- a certain federal agency is given a certain amount of funding, and the agency is directed to expend those dollars specifically on the indicated project and on nothing else. In this case, Congress could do a couple of things. For example, they could give NASA $14 million and direct that the funds be used to decommission and transport an orbiter to NMUSAF and to nowhere else. They could also get the NASA administrator in front of the Senate or House committees that control NASA's budget, and tell him that his budget requests will be delayed/ignored until he changes his mind on the final disposition of the orbiters. Congress does periodically direct federal agencies to do something, as in the case where Congress directed the Navy to give clear title to the Brewster Corsair to Pirate Lex. However, direction to agencies is usually best done inside a funding authorization bill. The simplest thing here would be for Congress to put language in a bill that said "Orbiter _____ will be decomissioned and transferred to _______ (fill in the blank here with your favorite shuttle location)" and then "here is the $_____" to do just that. Federal agencies' first line of defense when Congress wants them to do something is to say, "we don't have the budget to do that. But with a little more funding..."

So yes, it can be done. But you also have to keep in mind that half plus one of the 435 U.S. Representatives and 51 of the 100 U.S. Senators would also have to agree, and the President would have to sign the legislation. I think the only real hope of this happening is getting a small piece of legislation tacked onto a huge appropriations bill that is destined for passage.

kevin

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FOUND the elusive DT-built B-24! Woo-hoo!!!

Well heck, you found it on the internet, it MUST be true!

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Curator - EAA Aviation Museum, Oshkosh, WI
"Let No Story Go Untold!"
http://www.timelessvoices.org

I am no fan of politics but I do not see how you or anybody else in the military have been done wrong by this. Exactly how is sending a shuttle to another museum instead of the NMUSAF so offensive to veterens? Are there no vets that will visit the aircraft carrier in New York?

Having actually been to both, you can't compare the two. It is silly to think that it will get the same level of care as it would have in Dayton.

If you are a NMUSAF hater that is fine. But let's not dumb down the truth.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

I am not a hater of either museum and this has nothing to do with comparisons. I am just wondering why it is a slap in the face to veterens if the NMUSAF does not get the shuttle and the carrier does? They both are military themed places.

The blogs and forums have absolutely been lit-up by the blowblack, but as much as folks may want to make this a political issue I've found most of it boils down to tourist concentration...tho USAFM being excluded is still a puzzle to me.

Yep, we feel snubbed but our State legislators weren't much help...they weren't really interested until the last few weeks when the word leaked out that we we wouldn't be recieving a shuttle. A Governers aide was heard to say during a technology conference, that a shuttle for JSC was not a priority on their agenda.

What we were up against...tho we now have to temper the proposals against what the economic downturn has left us with...a glass Quonset hut for the Intrepid display? Ambitious...
http://swamplot.com/no-shuttle-parking- ... 011-04-12/

Comments from Wayne Hale's blog, former Shuttle Program Administrator and Flight Director....
http://waynehale.wordpress.com/2011/04/ ... a-shuttle/

edit

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He bowls overhand...He is the most interesting man in the world.
"In Peace Japan Breeds War", Eckstein, Harper and Bros., 3rd ed. 1943(1927, 1928,1942)
"Leave it to ol' Slim. I got ideas...and they're all vile, baby." South Dakota Slim
"Ahh..."The Deuce", 28,000 pounds of motherly love." quote from some Mojave Grunt
DBF

warbird 2 that wasn't aimed at you or anyone else, but some think it is funny as the big bad NMUSAF got smacked. What is not going to be so funny is when these artifacts are in need of restoration because of improper care. NASA had a chance to do it right, and in the words of some of the USAF test pilots of the day, "Screwed the pooch".

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

And as far as an insult to veterans, the NMUSAF has started viewing each and every airframe in the collection as a memorial to those who had soemthing to do with it. Where would more people see the Shuttle? The NMUSAF. Where would more veterans see it? The NMUSAF. Where would it get the best preservation? Where would it's history be told best? Where did many of the crews come from that flew on it? It is a smack in the face to a collection that rivals that of the NASM. But the NMUSAF is not the only issue I have. The Museum of Flight should have recieved one. I have no issues with one going to CA. I have an issue with who is going to be in charge of it's care. Last I heard this museum has space craft that has had some questionable care issues.

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

Had an interesting conversation with a friend (not affiliated with either NASA or NASM - just wanted to get this out up front) who has a really good depth of knowledge in the area of the shuttles today. The plot here may be thickening.

According to him, NASA signed ownership of Enterprise over to NASM back in the mid-80s. With the proviso that if NASA needed Enterprise - or pieces of her* - to support the shuttle program they could reclaim.

I also recall a conversation I had with a NASM staffer a few years back during one of their "Night at the Museum" open houses where she said that Discovery would be coming to Dulles and "We'll have to find a good home for Enterprise" (that's a fairly verbatim quote, specifically the use of "we'll").

Makes me wonder whether NASA really made the decision on where to send Enterprise ... or whether they just got to announce a decision that was made by NASM. If anyone has more insight on this, would be appreciated.

On a more amusing note, did everyone read Chuck Schumer's trash-talking Texas/Houston/JSC over their attempts to claim an Orbiter? "Don't Mess with New York". Yeah, real original there Chuck ...

(* this was done years ago for the nose gear assembly when NASA was exploring modifying the strut travel of the ones on the operational orbiters to reduce wear/tear, and more notably for the wing leading edge pieces and main gear doors taken for the Columbia investigation. Enterprise has a good deal of space-rated hardware in her, including her payload bay doors).

I wouldn't be too excited to see it go to the Naval Museum(even though I think its a good idea) it might end up on the bottom of some foreign ocean!

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Shop the Airplane Bunker At
www.warbirdbunker.com

No more insight, but assumptions appear to have been made by folks at Smithsonian NASM but as delivery gets closer they're starting to see the light. The following article gives an idea of how extensive NASA's "transition and retirement" mods and substitutions will be. Hundreds of parts to be replaced and removed from the shuttles for study or possible future use...
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/02/scien ... .html?_r=1

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He bowls overhand...He is the most interesting man in the world.
"In Peace Japan Breeds War", Eckstein, Harper and Bros., 3rd ed. 1943(1927, 1928,1942)
"Leave it to ol' Slim. I got ideas...and they're all vile, baby." South Dakota Slim
"Ahh..."The Deuce", 28,000 pounds of motherly love." quote from some Mojave Grunt
DBF

So what is the lastest construction news from the future homes of the shuttle?

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Chris Henry
EAA Aviation Museum Manager

I've met Valerie Neal a few times, and read some of her published works. Not sure I'd really want to be around her these days.

I'm intrigued, and possibly ticked, at how they're removing the windows. IIRC there was an incident with Atlantis a few flights back where part of a worklight got jammed between the instrument panel cowling and a window. At the time NASA was saying that if they couldn't find a non-invasive way to remove the part they wouldn't fly her again. It had to be non-invasive because NASA no longer had the capability (tooling had been destroyed when the overhaul facility in CA was shut down) to actually take the windows out and put them back in again. If that was right, taking out the windows is the functional equivalent of cutting through wing spars - and it will absolutely ensure that no one can come along and try to reactivate the shuttle program down the road (like what happened with the SR-71s).

THEN there's this amusing part: "“We don’t want to take a chance that if it’s sitting in the Smithsonian it could somehow detonate,” Ms. Stilson said." Guess NASM really did learn it's lesson after finding those live (and fairly ancient) explosive bolts in the pre-restoration Do-335. The restoration guys who would lead the old Saturday Garber Facility tours LOVED to tell that story and having to evac while the PG County Bomb Squad tried to figure out what to do ...