Warbird Information Exchange

I hear that P-40K long fuselage is being built by Murray Griffiths at Wangaratta. Dont know much about about the aircraft's ID or the owners details. But its definately a K model.

Can anyone add any information to this?

I understood all the P40s flown by the RAAF 75 & 76 Squadrons at the Battle for Milne Bay in August 1942 were P40E's and that the RAAF didnt receive any P40K's until February 1943?

I understand Murray is restoring the P40E A29-28 / 41-5336 for the RAAF Museum and that this aircraft was reputed to have flown at Milne Bay?

It was flown in combat with 75 Squadron over Port Morseby in April 1942 but its listed as being
damaged in May 1942 and under repair until re-issue in November 1942? so it may have missed Milne Bay?


Seperately a project in South Australia was announced a few years ago to restore P40E A29-99 / 41-35974 "Cleopatra" and that aircraft is documented to have flown with 75 Squadron at Milne Bay, and I assume its fuselage rebuild might well progress through Murray's workshop at some stage?

I'm not aware of the US operating any P40-Ks at Milne Bay, unless it was after the 1942 Battle?

A RAAF P40K is held by Graham Orphan of Classic Wings magazine NZ, that is A29-183 /42-10178 and joined the RAAF and 77 squadron in February 1943, and again that could be expected to progress through Murray's workshop at some time, I understand this is the sole surviving RAAF P40K, but again that saw service after the battle for Milne Bay.



Regards

Mark Pilkington

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20th Century - The Age of Manned Flight
"from Wrights to Armstrong in 66 years -WOW!"

Howdy All

From what I gather the P-40K is basically another ID Replica build at Precision, for Peter Smythe of SA

Lightning

Wrong, not for Peter Smythe of SA and not just an ID. I do know something of its history, the remains coming through a couple of sets of owners including myself but poor health has meant its been passed on to another group. Its been collected from a number of states - don't ask but essentially was cut in two after a mid air collision, not sure on the outcome of the pilots. Its amazing that an aircraft can be collected from 3 or 4 nearby locations but I supposed desperate times meant desperate measures. I still retain a single prop (unserviceable) for this aircraft though and thats about it. I also understand it had a kill to its name but those details escape me at this time.




Digger
Peter Smythe

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Peter
ESAD (E-Science and Digitalisation)

Howdy Digger

Any pics of the P-40K wreckage your talking about !
What about the P-40E ID you have also ?

Lightning

Thanks for the info Digger, however i must agree with Lightning. I was down at Precision recently and had a good look at the aircraft and honestly can tell you i could not see one original part in the ship! Everything was new manufacture! and i mean everything. And i am not talking about the skin work, every casting, fitting, engine mount was newly made, nothing whatsover original.
Digger i would also like to see some photos? It is no secret that you have been getting around trying to buy up as many original parts as possible , and i quote "to pin together an original airframe". Its great to see you gatherthing up bits but you cannot claim they are all from the same aircraft? I personally think it is unfair to claim an aircraft ID with one original part? for example say with just an original armour plate installed. Lets preserve history without distorting and exagerating the truth.

Metalman

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Lets keep old metal flying

Metalman, as possibly one of those people who tried to sell me something that did not belong to them I find your comments humorous in the least. I would therefore challenge your opinion about what was new and what has not been tested, cleaned and replaced. I no longer own any P-40 projects but still research and collect for others and the new owners of the two aircraft I was associated with.

I have learned not to send images out after having a significant spitfire recovery cleaned out from underme, even after a court order determined I was the rightful owner.
Luckily, a good percentage of this aircraft ended up with a collector of the type who intends to rebuild the a/c.

This is my third response to these questions and the site fails to upload them so this version is shorter.

The days of finding complete aircraft are gone or few and very far between. Its no longer a game or toys for the filthy rich. Its an achievable outcome for many, whether to static of fly.

I try to incorporate as much original material as legally possible, then I use as much original material as possible, then I used as much NOS as I can get then I rely on new build material. Thats how I work and thats how I presented the case on behalf of the new onwer to MG. I can only assume that MG has decided that new build is a safer option than a 70 year old piece that has only just made the grade. I would support such a decision purely from a safety point of view.



Hope this clears up the matter

Digger aka Peter Smythe

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Peter
ESAD (E-Science and Digitalisation)

Maybe ??? This is a guess ..I have no way of knowing this is he correct ID.....

http://www.adf-serials.com/


A29-186 P-40K-10 42-10195

Based on Clues.


Has a kill..
Involved in Collision
Pilot Killed

You are correct Paul and I'm sorry I left out the ID previously.

The official court of inquiry found that both aircraft were conducting 'gun camera' training and identified that the aircraft diving onto the other did not allow enough distance. The prop cutting the lower aircraft in two, resulting in both falling apart and coming to rest over a large area.





Digger

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Peter
ESAD (E-Science and Digitalisation)

I think this was

P-40E A29-99 / 41-35974 "Cleopatra"


See above

I had A29-99 from my own work and had it registered etc, then when 186 came on the market I purchased it.
that gave me 99(35974) and 186(10195) but since that time my health has caused me to reconsider my priorities.
I retain a research, collection and advisory role with both because thats about all I can handle at the minute and I
continue to accept research opportunities as I find it helps me stay focussed.

Having said that I may have to give the entire game away or I may become more involved at a later stage, it depends.




Digger

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Peter
ESAD (E-Science and Digitalisation)

What happened to the Oxford bits ?

Croweater

If anyone has seen "BIG JULIE".Tell him Hollywood and Hang send our warmest regards.

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Hang The Expense

Hi All,
I find it interesting that this topic of percentages keeps popping up. With the passage of time more aircraft are being returned to flight from absolute piles of scrap which not too long ago was considered worthless. The effort and financial commitment is to be admired and applauded by these individuals. It's very easy to criticize. I would ask yourself what are you doing? If the answer is nothing maybe you need to go and think about being involved.
And Peter I hope your illness is not too serious and you make a full recovery.
Cheers,
Ashley.

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Desoto

Certainly, Ashley. But bear in mind some of those critics or rivet counters are involved and some play a role in ensuring that things are not mis-represented as being more original than they are and thus worth more in historical terms and cold, hard cash, than they should be.

Right now there's cases of prestige fighters being offered for sale or approval where the discription is (at the most polite) a stretch of reality, and in other cases worse. Overstating the rarity and originality of a type will add cash value, and only a fool would take an auction house or previous owner's claims at face value, unless documented. And who provides much of that documentation and checks on them? Mainly the 'critics' and enthusiasts.

I'm not aware that there's any serious attempt to degenerate the work of those who restore from, as you say, even less material than before. But I for one am certainly well over having some rich guy (or museum director that should know better) tell me his aircraft is 'fully original' when we both know it isn't, and he's just got used to everyone agreeing with him.

And also, finally, sometimes also there are those that know and don't comment - there's scant recognition of that tactful silence.

Just some things for some (perhaps not Ashley - he knows this!) to think about.

Regards,

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James K

"Switch on the underwater landing lights"
Emilio Largo, Thunderball.

www.VintageAeroWriter.com