Warbird Information Exchange

With the US Navy now retiring their T-34 Charlie models, is there ANY way a civilian group or individual could acquire one? In the 80s the navy sold off their T-28s and it would be nice if they did something similar with the T-34c. Ive read that it takes congressional action to acquire a surplus Warplane from the the Government but does the same apply to the T-34c as it is not a warplane?

It would be very difficult to obtain one.
Please perform a search on these boards as this has been discussed many times before.
The airplanes are worn out from students attempting to alter the earths orbit, ie, hard landings. The airframes have reached the fatigue life limit, and that is the reason that they are being replaced.
The airplanes are being scrapped on site, and not going to Davis-Monthan at all.

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If God had wanted man to fly behind a flat motor, Pratt Whitney would've built one.

Just an information tidbit on the sale of these aircraft to civilians.... Sometime ago when Navy production orders were finished (mid 1980's ???); there was a cry from the civilian aviation world for Raytheon to offer these aircraft for public sale. I guess because it is a training aircraft (Falklands war not withstanding) there wasn't too much red tape. Anyway, at the then price tag of $1 million (???) there were no takers.

Last time I was at the Pensacola museum @ 2004 there were dozens of ex-flying club T-34B's (Piston, O-470 powered) on the ramp with the museum airplanes. When are those going to be released for sale?
Those are a lot more within the average pilot's reach than something with a PT-6 on the front end.

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All I did was press this red button here...

I remember that Beech actually had a civilian demonstrator model in white and blue markings that they took around in the early '80's.

And as one of those who "attempted to alter the earths orbit" in the Turbo Weenie, I have to say I loved that little airplane. More horsepower than you could want or ever need, in a nimble little airframe that was rock solid, could pull a lot of g's and still not get into any kind of trouble (regardless of how much b.s. the contract mechanics would give you). Some of the most fun I've ever had flying was in the T-34C.

If I could afford to buy one, I'd love to paint one up in the markings of the plane I soloed in and fly it around the circuit.

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Offer me solutions, offer me alternatives, and I decline......

Beech/Raytheon has done everything they can to get ALL the T-34's out of private hands. The last big dustup with the wing failures, the only inspection compliance that they would approve would have required an inspection so detailed and involved, that one would have to practically destroy the wing to accomplish it. Fortunately much cooler heads within the FAA and the Type Clubs prevailed and were able to have a rigorous enough inspection process approved.

I watched a Beech demonstrator make a smoking hole in the dirt at a Mildenhall Air Fete in the early 1980s. Beech had brought it to the UK to demonstrate it to the RAF who were holding a competition for a Jet Provost replacement (subsequently won by the Shorts-upgraded Tucano). He had finished his rehearsed routine, and was filling in before the next act when he stalled off the top of a vertical manouvre.

Just like with any aeroplane...as long as you fly it within the established parameters given for any specific maneuver, you don't end up that smoking hole in the ground.

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Offer me solutions, offer me alternatives, and I decline......

As long as there are potential plainfiffs and lawyers
out there who believe in perpetual liability this can't
happen. As many times as the fleet has been grounded
for problems over the last few years I wouldn't get in
one if you paid me. Probably 20 years ago there was
talk of some of the very early T-34s being used as
trade bait. The FAA didn't like 'em; something about
the firewall. I don't remember exactly; been too long.

There really isn't anything preventing DoD from surplusing the T-34C other than the desire to do it. The aircraft are built to FAA Type design, are not tactical aircraft, and would be eligible for Acrobatic category per Type Certificate A26CE http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guida ... enDocument
. If anyone would have a handle on it, it would be the Nogles and the T-34 group.

I am not aware of any civilian T-34A/B aircraft that were sold back in the day in civilian configuration from the factory. There probaly were a few. The T-34 became a popular aircraft after the military was finished with them. Several agencies ended up with them and flew them quite a bit before being replaced by more modern aircraft (i.e. USFS, CAP, etc). Following that second life the aircraft have become a very nice "warbird" to own and restore.

Out and out scrapping of aircraft such as the T-34C is the work of fools. I probably won't get any arguments on that topic. True, Beech has not been helpful with regards to supporting the T-34 fleet. Actually if you get in your way-back machine you will find Beech was not real helpful in resolution of V tail issues either. The V tail issues caused Mike Smith to be put out of business through Beech's activities. (Google mike smith bonanza mods)Beech wasn't good with the 18 series either... Gee wonder why the company is on the bricks? See a common thread?

Sad to hear the aircraft being K-balled on site. Does anyone have some pictures? (just to make us cry)

Any aircraft can be extended with regards to fatigue life (i.e. replace wings, spars, etc.) if the manufacturer would wish to support them. With that goes affordability. With all of the T-34A/B STC fixes on the wings Beech missed an opportunity to sell about 150 sets of new wings. Beech could have owned the business.

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Bill Goebel
aka TPFD

Vintage Aircraft Services
Aircraft restoration and rebuilding
Rhome, TX

http://www.vintageaircraftservices.net

My personal opinion from working on Raytheon aircraft for 25 plus years.... Beech (Raytheon), Hawker-Beech: hates legacy aircraft. I can give many examples, including their purchase of most of the existing Starships and some other types deemed a liability hazard/corporate headache. How they were talked into selling new "Charlie" model T-34's to civilians, I don't know. But, as I said, none were sold. I attempted to talk with a Beech rep. about the T-34A/B wing, the conversation didn't last 4 seconds. Beech isn't too happy to support their Barons built prior to about 1992, either.

This one is civilian owned. It's apparently a B that was converted to a YT-34C. Owned by an individual in Chandler, Arizona.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/chrisk48/5108634977/

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Chris Kennedy
Peoria, AZ

They sure would be fun to fly...







Ryan

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Aerial Photographer with Red Wing Aerial Photography currently based at KRBD and tailwheel CFI.
Websites: Texas Tailwheel Flight Training, DoolittleRaid.com and Lbirds.com.

The horse is prepared against the day of battle: but safety is of the LORD. - Prov. 21:31 - Train, Practice, Trust.

I'd started one once at 5C1, Nice a/c, hit the switch, 12% bring the fuel in and let it spool up and then turn on the a/c...

Ryan ask Brannock about it...

HAH! When/where were those pictures taken, Ryan? I just went back and checked my logbook and between June and October 1992 I flew 162300 four times with VT-27 out of NAS Corpus Christi (TAW-4, Tail Code G). Looks like two flights in Primary phase (two Formation flights), and two flights in Basic phase (one R-Nav and one V-Nav).

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Offer me solutions, offer me alternatives, and I decline......